Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!
Bi-Weekly bin collections coming to Harringay
With bi weekly rubbish collections coming our way this summer, Liberal Democrat politicians in parts of the borough where it's already operating have been making it known that they strongly oppose fortnightly waste collections and have called for an urgent review of the changes to the service.
But the Labour-led council says it has no plans to review the bin collections and claim that most people in the borough have responded positively to the changes.
The move, which is expected to save the council £900,000 per year, aims to encourage more people to recycle. Garden and food waste is still collected weekly.
The changes, which include replacing small green recycling boxes with large wheelie bins, were introduced to the west of the borough at the beginning of March.
Tags for Forum Posts: fortnightly waste collections, new recycling bins, rubbish, veolia, waste collection
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Liz on
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Well, as I explained here, I fully support the move. The campaign to undermine this is irresponsible to say the least. There are legitimate concerns about the roll out and I think all councillors are well within their rights to challenge how well Veolia are carrying out these measures. The ear-bending I gave the Veolia team at the Area Forum about my concerns re poor understanding of the new system leading to piled up rubbish and dumping is no doubt typical of the complaints they can expect to receive.
However, the thrust of the Lib Dem campaign that weekly collections of landfill rubbish should be retained is a nonsense. Whether we like it or not (and I'm aware that many don't) we simply have no choice in this matter. There are very few places left to dig holes to bury our rubbish, we are storing up a whole heap of trouble with the stuff we already bury and the next step which is to dump it on poor countries is I'm sure you'll agree simply delaying the inevitable, not to mention the issue of fairness in expecting other countries to clean up after us like spoiled brats.
I do not normally associate Lib Dems with irresponsible non-sustainable policies. I'm disappointed that they are opposing this and hope they stop such short-sighted campaigning as soon as possible.
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Permalink Reply by Justin Guest on
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I agree with Nick Liz!
I find the Lib Dems position on this as cynically political. The reality is that their position is reactionary at best, and not as progressive as I would expect from the LDs. Basically, they have realised that we are all inherently opposed to change (and dare I say having to make some effort and take some responsibility), and there are possibly votes in it. I doubt very much that the policy is driven by any real arguments as to the merits of one approach over the other.
I was a bit supprised, and heartly saddened by seeing their literature on this topic!
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Permalink Reply by Alan Stanton on
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"Landfill rubbish?"
Has Haringey/Veolia stopped sending the bulk of the waste for incineration at North London Waste? When did this happen?
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So none of it now goes to landfill? Is it all burned? A quick google reveals that burning the waste generates electricity. Doh! I'm wasting my time urging people to recycle. Why are we even bothering then? Carry on as you are people, creating mountains of waste because now we burn it for fuel.
Oh wait, turns out the ash is toxic and fumes from the incinerator may be linked to higher rate of infant deaths around the area. Moreover, this is an hugely inefficient way to deal with waste. Of course, Greenpeace may be hugely exaggerating the risks. You know what they're like...
What about former Environment Minister Michael Meacher who has said, "I repeat, the emissions from incinerator processes are extremely toxic. Some of the emissions are carcinogenic. We must use every reasonable instrument to eliminate them altogether."
So, whether its buried or burned is beside the point really. The fact is surely that to suggest first of all that there will be a 50% cut in waste collection when in fact it is waste sent to the incinerator is irresponsible. All recyclable and compostable materials will continue to be collected weekly and since the majority of our waste can be recycled this means that the majority of our waste will continue to be collected weekly.
Local councillors of all hues should be working hard to help their residents to recycle and reduce, not suggesting that there needs to be no change. They have a big role to play in ensuring that Veolia are doing the job they were contracted to do and ensuring that the outreach work promised is being done to get people to understand the new systems. They should not be implying that there could be a reversal on this. I doubt that fits in with national targets for recovery of household waste, quite apart from the ethical concerns about encouraging short-termism and unsustainable practices for the sake of a few votes.
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Liz, to clarify, I wasn't suggesting no change. In fact the option for having fortnightly collections comes from a major continuing change across the country - progress made in increasing recycling rates and making people aware of the need to recycle even more.
Nor was I claiming that none of Haringey's waste goes to landfill. I was genuinely puzzled to read comments suggesting that our waste is now either recycled or goes to landfill.
By all means let's have public debate about the real risks of incinerating waste. But please let's have that debate - as far as possible - on a widely agreed and broadly accurate factual basis of what goes where, why, and the dangers.
Let's also have some factual discussion about how the new waste arrangements have actually gone so far in different parts of Haringey. I thought that experiment and learning was a major reason for phasing the new scheme - rather than beginning everywhere at once.
Maybe more of us need to say to our councillors and Haringey senior officers that we expected both successes and problems with the new scheme. And would rather know, warts 'n' all, what they are. But also how we are learning from and solving the problems.
And perhaps saying clearly that not a lot of people are keen to read or listen to party point-scoring on the issue - either from my party or another. And especially "it's-a-terrible-mess-can't-possibly work"; "or everyone's-delighted-it's-all-going-well" clowning.
(Labour councillor Tottenham Hale)
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Permalink Reply by Bob Ruggles on
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All Waste from Haringey goes to Edmonton Incinerator and is burn't Generating Electricity
Burning Waste Saves importing Gas & Oil -
Surely the biggest joke is the Councils - Haringey - Recycling sysytem where All waste is tipped into back of a Dustcart mixed - so really worthless - except Garden Waste -
Yes Funds are limited - But Councillors are still spending Millions of Road Schemes which Only Benefit the Contractors -
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Permalink Reply by Lucy Fielding on
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Yes Bob you have made a very good point. Householders are being forced to do the council's job for them by sorting out items into different categories and then it's all for nothing because it all ends up in the same place anyway! Pointless!
This is just a cost cutting exercise by the council disguised as a green initiative. Few residents were consulted about fortnightly collections and no discussion has taken place about the best way to dispose of rubbish or what to do if you don't have room for more wheelie bins.
Many people in the area want a cleaner and greener environment - we don't need a draconian council to force this upon us. We are already paying the council through our taxes to collect and recycle rubbish. This is a very basic service that we are already paying for. The onus is on the council to improve their recycling facilities - not on residents to do their job for them!
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". . . sorting out items into different categories and then it's all for nothing because it all ends up in the same place anyway! Pointless!"
Yes, it would be pointless Lucy, if that is what happens. But rather than say (again) this is not what happens, I'd like to suggest that you and Bob (and maybe a few other people) go and take a look.
If up to, say, half a dozen people want to go, I'm happy to ask Haringey, Veolia and North London Waste to arrange a trip to Edmonton. Bring an open mind: take your notebooks and cameras, ask questions and see for yourselves. Please let me know.
(Tottenham Hale ward councillor. alan.stanton@virgin.net )
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Thank you for taking the time to respond Alan and for clarifying the situation with regards to recycling and for your invitation. I'm an environmental science student so seeing what happens would be of interest to me. Perhaps you could let us know some dates and times and we can book up to go if we can.
I guess I'm annoyed because we weren't consulted about fortnightly collections and I'm irked by the fact that I was told that an inspector would have to visit my property to determine whether I am correct that we are unable to accommodate yet another 240 litre plastic wheelie bin. Isn't that a waste of man resources and time? It's like the council thinks I am trying to get away with doing something wrong!
What's going to happen to all the old bins that they take away? Wouldn't it be less wasteful if all the big current bins were designated recycling bins and then just have either the small ones for landfill - or if they weren't big enough then have slightly bigger ones? Having said that all our bins are full to the brim every week so not sure how we'll cope with fortnightly collections.
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Thanks, Lucy. I'll wait a few days and see if anyone else is interested in going. Then get back to you.
By the way, I don't claim expertise on recycling. But I try to keep an open mind, ask questions and think for myself. Plainly you take the same approach.
(Tottenham Hale ward councillor. alan.stanton@virgin.net )
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This does sound like an interesting idea. I wouldn't mind coming along too, if there's room!
If it could be on a weekend then that would be great. I work outside of town so mid-week is a bit tricky.
Thanks for suggesting this, Alan - much appreciated.
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