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Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!

Dog shit

Yesterday I came a cropper trying to navigate a pram and a toddler past a pile of dog shit in the passage right outside the entry to SHJS. What can we do??? I'm so fed up with lazy dog owners who just can't see why they should clean up after their pets.

I know that the Council have put up lots of bins and strongly worded signs, but I can't really see how they can enforce the law (and I'm sure that is what the dog owners think too). I've heard people mention CCTV, but how would that work if all you have is a blurry picture of a dog/owner and a pile of poop?

Is there any way of persuading people that cleaning up after their dog is the best thing to do? Frankly, it they can't be bothered to clean up outside a busy school gate that to me suggests someone who really does not give a **** about where they live - and is there any realistic way of getting through to someone like that?

Sorry, rant over. Does anyone have any ideas? And can anyone solve the mystery of the person who paints round the poo in yellow?!!! I completely applaud their desire to highlight this, but am intrigued about their method.

Tags for Forum Posts: dog, dog poo, passage

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Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by rahman on February 17, 2008 at 13:23
i think that would help - dont know how much we could realistically prettify them, given that they are so narrow. its worth thinking about though.
Permalink Reply by Liz on February 17, 2008 at 19:54
In response to Rahman's point, I noted earlier that South Harringay Infants Parent Staff association have plans to 'green the passage' between the school and the new children's centre and have applied for a grant from 'Breathing Spaces' .
I also noticed in the minutes of December's LCSP meeting that Paul McKay of Living Streets was noted as saying that he would like another audit of Harringay Passage, probably in the Spring of this year perhaps with combined an Open Day/ Passage Awareness (no comments please:)) Day similar to one held held a couple of years ago. Did anyone take part in this and could they tell us more?
I was wondering if Living streets are on this site and whether it was possible to ask them to comment / update on anything going on around the Passage (settle down). Given the interest in the debates around anything to do with the passage, wouldn't this be useful?
Adam has also suggested meeting to discuss this earlier in the post. It is time surely to support initiatives that seek to put pressure on the council to take these issues seriously
Permalink Reply by matt on February 17, 2008 at 22:17
Liz, Paul McKay is your point of contact. He is or was Secretary of Living Streets for this area and has been struggling with raising the profile of the Passage for years. He was instrumental in getting the dog poo bins installed and the school signs designed and put up in the Passage.

He is the man of many Battles of the Poo.

A policeman & council officer have been on patrols in the past to specifically catch offenders (ie. owners of dogs) who haven't picked up afterwards. They however caught no-one.
Permalink Reply by Liz on February 17, 2008 at 22:28
Is Paul M on the site Matt? How can he be contacted?
Permalink Reply by Hugh on February 17, 2008 at 22:55
He's here
Permalink Reply by Liz on February 17, 2008 at 23:09
Thanks Hugh. Message left
hannahPermalink Reply by hannah on February 17, 2008 at 14:26
I think Hugh has a good point, humour and a slightly wacky approach may help. I suppose, human nature being what it is, people don't like being told what to do or told off. I suppose, Hugh, you could always take a nice picture of a pile of the stuff (slightly different features of Harringay, admittedly, than you are used to capturing!), print underneath "is this yours, now on my floors", print off as flyers and a team of us could stick them throught the letterboxes of the Ladder.

To drive home the effect it has on others, one of us could take a photo of a barefoot toddler walking through a pile of (chocolate sauce of course but they don't know that) stuff on a kitchen floor! A bit like the Government anti-drinking campaign adverts - nothing like rubbing it home!

Or a more direct approach "next time we see your doggy poo, we'll post it back to you".
Scoop_The_PoopPermalink Reply by Scoop_The_Poop on February 17, 2008 at 16:29
These posters were produced and located in Harringay passage next to north and south Harringay schools in the autumn of last year.

A press release was sent to all local papers and articles appeared in the Hornsey Journal and some of London’s free evening newspapers.

Apart from vigilante action which isn’t really advisable, shaming and naming the culprits is in my opinion a great way to catch these people.

Lots of people have cameras on their phones and could take pictures if they saw anyone committing this crime.

Any suggestions that could be put into action for the nest step of the Sack the Cack (or Scoop the Poop for younger audience) campaign would be welcomed.

STC
Attachments:
hannahPermalink Reply by hannah on February 17, 2008 at 17:15
A good idea could be for the council to provide covered poop bins, mini shovels and mini plastic bag dispensers at intervals along the passage. This would encourage those who merely cannot be bothered to carry the necessary tools with them. For hygiene's sake the shovels could be contained in little cannisters attached to the wall. Discreet, but possibly effective.
Permalink Reply by Mark B on February 17, 2008 at 17:36
I still think there is more to it as some owners will never clean up however easy you make it. I really think the council should start prosecuting. Else why bother putting up the signs in the first place?

After a very close to being violent encounter with a dog owner last Nov, after I politely asked him to clean up after his animal I emailed our three councillors using the addresses on the council www site to ask: “how many people have been prosecuted”. I didn’t even get an auto-reply saying these addresses are not used. Nothing. Adam tells us the answer to my question is no-one. I know its sad but I am really not surprised about that. But with a 2 year old who runs down our streets pointing and shouting “dog poo”, its all a bit glum isn’t it.

When I first worked in Reykjavik in the 80’s I thought it was really odd that dogs were banned and could be shot on sight. Weird thing is I now don’t think that is such a bad idea!

Loony or what? I like animals! I have even been known to eat them very occasionally (thanks Baldwins).

So for me, the punch-line is the council really need to prosecute. My partner saw the community support officers get someone who urinated in the passage the other week so it is possible….
Permalink Reply by Birdy_Too on February 17, 2008 at 18:08
Yes you are right Mark, a crazy idea to ban dogs. Why should the majority of responsible dog owners suffer because of a minority?

I have one dog now, the other carked it last week at the grand age of twelve and they are very much part of the family. Should we ban children as well because some of them are anti social? Very right wing policy!

The council and police need to make it a priority to prosecute. As STC stated we need to supply photos and information about these people. After several close encounters with aggressive dog owners my advise would be to keep your gob shut, and inconspicuously follow them home, take a note of where they live and do things through the correct channels.
Permalink Reply by Alison P on February 18, 2008 at 21:32
Thank you for all the posts on this (sorry if anyone offended by bluntness of its title!). I thought it might be worth a go at summarising the main themes …

1. The need for regular cleaning. If this happens then the problem for everyone is kept as minimal as possible. Plus it looks less grotty, which might make people more reluctant to let their dogs foul it (perhaps..). (On a related theme see the suggestions about trying to prettify the passage – one example being the ideas for the passage by South Harringay School.) So a key issue here is making sure that Accord are equipping their staff properly. It will also be interesting to hear whether Haringey do take up the mechanical pooper-scooper option. For information, does anyone know how often the passage is/should be swept?

2. Encouraging owners to scoop, and various ways of ‘getting the message home’… Loads of different suggestions here. Leaflets through doors, more posters in passage, individual signs in dog poo, provision of covers/scoops/bags in the passage. I quite liked Hannah’s leaflet suggestion – I don’t think that has been done yet, worth a try?

3. Enforcement. Nobody has ever yet been fined for dog fouling, despite all the new signs etc. I’d like to know what would need to happen for someone to be fined. For eg, Birdy2 suggests following someone home if you see them letting their dog foul the pavement and then reporting them – would the council fine someone in these circumstances? Would you need photographic evidence (and if so what – just a picture of the poo? Or of the dog in the act etc etc)? The higher the amount of proof, the less likely any fines (can just imagine the one time I see a dog doing this my camera phone will be full etc etc – you get my point).

4. A variety of groups have been mentioned as being interested in raising/dealing with this? Including LCSP and our councillors, the STC campaign, Living Streets. Liz has kindly emailed Paul McKay (Living Streets) and it will be great to hear what he thinks. I’d also be interested in whether Scoop the Poop has any future plans we should know about.

That's enough for now I'm sure!

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