Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!
Gating the Ladder
How would you feel about gating the passage ways of the Ladder? I could be completely wrong (as I don't use the passageways) but it appears to me that there are more costs than benefits to having free access to passways. They are poorly overlooked and offer too many opportunities to a criminal - no escape routes for victim in the passage way, quick escape route for criminal from street. These areas could be kept for wheelie bin storage or something more creative instead.
Tags for Forum Posts: crime, design, dog poo, ladder, new river path, passage, the, urban
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by alistairj on
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Most of the passage isn't really viable for 'proper cycling', as it is narrow, with bollards/barriers at each end and pedestrians in between, so I tend to use one segment only to get on a (one-way) ladder road down to Green Lanes. I don't see why the police should be bothered unless you are not giving way to pedestrians.
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Permalink Reply by empyrean_aisles on
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Wow, I had no idea I could be fined £50 for cycling in the Passage! That seems incredibly stupid, for all the reasons that have been pointed out. Wightman is way dangerous, and Green Lanes doesn't feel much safer (as you have to ride so close to parked cars and hence run the risk of being slammed by someone opening a car door without first checking to see if a cyclist is coming).
I think I will go and start up a cycling group on this site. Be good to get some more feedback on the cycle locker idea (from the '£10 000 for your pet project' thread). Cyclists, come over & join me!
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Permalink Reply by matt on
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So the passage stays open and cyclists are in uproar, in need of better facilities.
These conversations have an interesting way of meandering to their conclusion. And no meetings in halls needed, no councillor in sight!
Cycle group; very good idea. :)
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Permalink Reply by David Smith on
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gating the passage way would be a good idea. but it does seem a shame to lock it off completely
Alas there would still be the dog owners who frequently allow thier dogs to foul there and do not clean it up
much better would be cameras and good lighting and maybe patrols by the local pcso's at night
As for cyclists they should not be using it as a couple of times my grandson has nearly been hit by Cyclists speeding through it
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Permalink Reply by rahman on
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i dont think the passages should be used by cyclists - the fine was brought in for a reason. i remember an elderly pedestrian being quite badly injured whilst walking down our road as a cyclist failed to slow down when exiting the passage and collided with him. its just asking for trouble really!
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Permalink Reply by Liz on
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The passage is essential for the parents and teachers of the two primary schools on it to get their children to and from school more safely and the council sees it as an essential part of their walk to school programme. Despite the problems, parents prefer to walk their children here rather than the busy main roads both for safety and distance. At certain times of the day, it is a very busy thoroughfare, classes going to the swimming pool and children going to the after school club, as well as parents going to and from school. South Harringay school have plans to 'green' part of it. Perhaps we should all 'adopt' a bit of the passage (names on bricks?:)) and do a bit of 'guerilla gardening' /children's murals etc. Reclaim the passage!
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Permalink Reply by TTTH on
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Interesting. Thinkin about a dissertation topic and this might be it, tho' I am also interested in the problems facing anti-social behaviour around the gate at Mountview Court. Does anyone know if this has been rectified? Seems v quiet on the Met police agenda.
To go back to this thread, someone mentioned River Village has free access around dwellings. but these are generally overlooked by other dwellings. I still think River Village is badly designed, and with all the expense I would question whether a "Secured by Design" consultant was not used. Time will tell whether this development suffers break ins. Or maybe they have security on site?
I understand the passage is well used by the schools, etc, but what is wrong with walking down your respective roads and walking along Green Lanes and Wightman Road? Cycle Lanes need to be 2m for cyclists and another 2m for pedestrians. I don't think the passageway is even 2m, is it? That might be why the Council are fining people.
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But why should we join the throng on the busy main roads when there is a perfectly serviceable, passage way that leads directly to the doors of the schools?
For the people leading groups of children, daily, between facilities it is a lot safer and less of a worry than negotiating the busy roads with small children who do have a tendancy to let their minds wander. (I have had to supervise long crocodiles of other people's children so I know about this!!!).
I don't see why the community has to lose out and sacrifice their right of way when the answer is better policing and policies to tackle anti-social behaviour.
(Are you doing qualitative research? Will I be quoted?:))
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Permalink Reply by Alison P on
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I agree with Liz. The passage is an effective and safe way to make short journeys in Harringay. Not just between schools, but between different roads and different ends of Harringay (eg up to Wood Green). I'm biased because I live really near the passage and use it all the time as a short cut. As said previously, I think the answer is for more people to use them.
On cycling. There is (as I understand it) no 'special' fine for people cycling down the passage - it is just the standard fine that is supposed to apply to people cycling where they shouldn't be (pavements etc). After seeing some of the comments I've made a resolution not to cycle down it any more, though am dreading trying out Wightman Rd tomorrow morning.
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Permalink Reply by Anette on
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I am not a big fan of the passage. I feel really unsafe there, and I have to constanly look down, to avoid stepping in anything nasty. It stinks, and I use it as little as possible. It's a shame, as it could potentially be so good and so handy for schools etc. As it is it's a filthy, stinking tip!
Another issue is people (mainly drunk) walking up and down it at night, screaming and shouting. And waking me up. Being woken up 3 or 4 times a night on the week-end is not uncommon. Also, the drunken fights and screaming or the drinking sessions (the bin by the passage is almost always full of tins of lager on Sat and Sunday morning, I guess people actually using the bin is a plus), and very loud talking is also a major sleep disturbance. Yes, I live just a few doors away from the passage, if you had not guessed...
My solution would be:
Passage shuts at 11:00 pm every night, with gates. Passage is cleaned upon opening again at 6am or thereabouts. Passage is patrolled on a regular basis during the day.
That should keep everyone happy. But I guess the cost would be staggering... Sigh.
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Your Idea about it closing at 11pm and reopening at 6 is a very valid and good idea,
I have just a couple of questions on that though
Who would lock it up and open it again in the morning ?
Doesnt Accord have the cleaning contract for the passage ?
If Acoord arent doin there job then isnt it time to get a company the does fufil their contract?
I live on Greenlanes but still use the passage as a way of staying of greenlanes when walking
to Wood green to aviod pedestrians and traffic fumes from cars and buses.
and it is smelly and you do have to aviod dog mess
which should be cleaned up by Accord
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I think the locking and opening should be done by the council. They have people to open / lock parks, so this should work. Or Haringey Accord could open it when they come in to clean it. IF they do indeed clean it that is. It would be interesting to know when and how often they do it. It should really be done early evry morning so that people can walk to school / work etc. without stepping in last nights sick and dogpoo.
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