Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!
St Ann's LTN start date - 22 August
I'm not sure whether this has been shared elsewhere on HOL - can't see it in a search but...
We have recently received a note through our front door that the St Ann's Low Traffic Neighbourhood will be implemented on 22 August.
This is a heads-up for anyone living in or driving through the area between West Green Road and St Ann's Road. There will no longer be a direct route between the two major roads unless you are a bus or have a 'X2' exemption pass.
Woodlands Park Road, Black Boy Lane, Cornwall Road and Avenue Road will all be closed to through traffic.
The restriction points will be monitored by CCTV, so no doubt LBH will be issuing lots of PCNs! Drivers beware!
I attach two documents, one a map of the area showing the traffic cells as they will be after implementation, and the other the supporting document.
Tags for Forum Posts: low traffic neighbourhoods, st anns ltn, traffic
- Attachments:
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LTN map.pdf, 834 KB -
LTN Doc.pdf, 1.1 MB
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Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Don on
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Karen — This is the wrong move at the wrong time. TfL are slashing bus routes and it looks as though rail fares are likely to rise by over 15% next January, so increasing traffic on main roads by closing side streets, slowing down remaining buses and making them even more unreliable isn’t the way forward. George Monbiot’s article (along with almost all other LTN apologists) ignores the need to put viable alternatives in place before road closures, not “maybe at some point in the future if you’re lucky”. Haringey has been seduced by “free” money from City Hall to tinker at the edges (bollards and flowerpots are cheap) instead of dealing with the fundamental problems of Green Lanes and electrification, which are much more expensive. The government has decreed the end of petrol/diesel vehicle production, so what alternative is there to electric power? People still need to get around.
In an ideal world, we’d all live close to our workplaces and have a range of good, affordable shops within walking distance for all of our needs, whilst being able to afford accommodation near green spaces, countryside, theatres and arts centres, and only a short walk from doctors, hospitals, elderly parents, schools, etc, etc. Sadly, London’s not like that: I commuted daily for years to Waterloo because Harringay was a (then affordable) OK place to live and cheaper than alternatives, and my colleagues used a variety of trains, tubes and buses to do the same; nobody lived next door in the increasingly-expensive high-rise flats along the south bank. If there’s a revolution and everyone can live 5 minutes from their work, it’d be delightful. Meanwhile, people have to travel, and making that more difficult without offering affordable solutions is bad policy.
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Permalink Reply by Sarah on
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In 2020 I used my travel card refund to buy a bike. I've saved an absolute fortune since.
I also choose to buy a flat within a short distance from work. Not a five minute walk, but three tube stops away, and now I cycle it takes a similar amount of time.
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Sarah - Delighted you've been able to make these changes. Sadly, the option of living so close to work isn't available to millions of Londoners -- I commuted for many years from Harringay to Waterloo by bus and tube because that's where my employer (a major arts organisation) is based, so I couldn't relocate my work and living closer wasn't affordable. Thousands of Haringey residents rely on public transport for their daily journeys (not all can work from home even now) and they are the people most likely to be affected by the combination of savage bus cuts and Haringey's plan to increase congestion on major roads/bus routes.
It's all very well to say, as you did in another post, that we need to reduce our reliance on cars but a) I see no evidence of this in the number of cars parked on the Ladder, for instance and b) without major investment in efficient, frequent, cheap public transport (conspicuously lacking) there is little or no incentive for those living further away and using Harringay as their route into central London to use alternatives to cars. A projected 15% increase in rail fares next January is also unlikely to persuade enyone to get out of their car.
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Permalink Reply by Annabel Gregory on
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Sorry to jump into an earlier part of this discussion - but would just like to say that there have been some improvements to public transport. If you were commuting to Waterloo now, it would just be a half-hour journey on the Great Northern from Harringay station to Blackfriars (changing at Finsbury Park), and then 15mins walk to Waterloo. It's now a great route, and not crowded (though probably partly because usage hasn't returned to pre-pandemic levels).
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Annabel — Thanks; didn’t know about the improvements. Living in St Ann’s, Harringay’s not the closest station, so my option was bus to Manor House, tube to Leics Square and change. Luckily it was many years ago, but it was often stressful, largely because of the unreliability of services. One reason why I think increased GL traffic from the LTN is a bad idea if it slows buses.
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Yes, I think this is why GL needs 24hr bus lanes, enabled by removing the parking. But I'll keep quiet now - I live in Haringey, but not in this neighbourhood!
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Permalink Reply by JulieB on
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I'm in St Ann's ward but what happens on the Ladder will affect me, in my opinion we are closely linked in terms of transport. I liked the fact that GLATS included the whole of Harringay.
My husband works near London Bridge, pre-covid he used to get the bus but now he walks to and from Harringay station and much prefers this route. It is quite a long walk from here though. -
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Annabel - Completely agree on the bus lanes. Council promises to improve GL at all (let alone before the LTN) have proved conspicuously lacking so far.
Julie - Yes, consultation outside the Ladder on proposed changes is vital, as what happens that side of GL has direct effects on the other side. Unfortunately, if the St Ann’s precedent is anything to go by, a tiny, vocal pressure group will influence council thinking into making changes that 95% of the ward population didn’t support. (The petition against the LTN now has over 1400 signatures, roughly twice as many as the number who supported its introduction in the consultation.)
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Permalink Reply by PeterPiper on
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Precisely, - I'll admit the topography is eminently suitable, but London is hardly well known for it's ski slopes.
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JJ B - It's a long time since I was in the Netherlands, but I'd suggest:
a) It's cultural. The country's basically flat, so cycling is/has been part of everyone's upbringing, whether in town or country.
b) The roads are wider. Yes, Amsterdam's got zillions of narrow canalside streets, but many other cities (and outside central A'dam) have wide boulevards that allow plenty of room for cycle lanes, car space and - crucially - pavements for pedestrians.
c) Public transport is excellent - perhaps the biggest and most important difference of all: trams throughout major cities (not a lot of metros, for obvious geological reasons!) integrated with buses and trains mean people can make many more journeys more easily and cheaply than in the UK.
Going to so many mainland European cities (Brussels, Berlin as further examples) shows how vital it is that cheap, frequent and reliable public transport exists to make commuting and other journeys easy and obviate the need to drive everywhere. Of course, most of these cities are smaller than London and many don't have the tight Victorian street plans we have. London may have a good tube network but, at street level, the bus network is now under sustained attack and the trams disappeared in 1952, so it's no surprise so many people use their cars. If public transport was improved enough before road closures were instigated, the whole LTN argument would be more persuasive, but London isn't prepared to spend the real money sorting this out would entail; instead, City Hall hands out scraps to the boroughs to make the cheapest, least effective changes it can get away with, egged on by a noisy cycling lobby that often takes a "holier than thou" attitude and has no time even for pedestrians.
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I understand that but people have grown to be very comfortable with their individual car ownership. The problem is the politicians aren’t telling them that we are up against a series of crises that means ‘business as usual’ just can’t continue.
I also follow the extremely strong attacks the present mayor of Paris gets for seemingly unpopular measures that is transforming the city centre. Her attackers make some of the points you make about London’s specificities - am saying that you are making attacks. I am aware that the Dutch had to find solutions to there problems, took radical action and keep adapting their interventions based on learning. We here need to do same.
So many of the arguments made against the LTNs are spurious too.
i won’t mention particular business lobbies that ‘have much influence’ over Haringey councillors.
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