Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!
Braddock and an Odd Hornsey Church Postcard
This is a postcard I would have liked to buy but someone beat me to it on ebay.
The odd thing about it is the gent in the foreground , because enhancing the overall image resulted in him looking a bit out of place photographically. Not only is his image a different tone to the rest of the photo but he seems rather diminutive compared with the height of the gates and fence. Also, am I imagining it but doesn’t the man look slightly more modern in dress than the 1870s? It was not unknown for early photographers to do a bit of photo editing, in the literal pre-computer sense, and in this instance he probably felt that the scene needed a person in the foreground. The lady in middle distance indicates the fence being about her shoulder height. The following card of further along the path shows it around elbow height to the men loitering there.
As to the viewpoint of the main image, this appears to be from a westerly direction, perhaps alongside what became the High Street, or maybe a footpath from about where Hillfield Avenue now runs:
The final quirks about this card are that it is a Braddock (see Hugh’s previous feature on this photographer) but 1876 is earlier than he was so far known to have been active in Hornsey; it is a “divided back” (address and writing together on back of card) which started to be allowed in UK from 1902; and it was posted in Sussex 1945 to a Crouch End address.
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Roy aka Smiffy on
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There seems to be a distinct outline around parts of his legs and there is a difference in contrast between him and the background.
He casts no shadow.... -
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Permalink Reply by Ken Stevens on
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I never noticed the shadow aspect. Gasps in horror at the implication !
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A new line of research Hugh, The Vampires of Hornsey.
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Permalink Reply by Hugh on
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Mmm, all very odd. I'm assuming that the cut and paste on the back was done by you so as to show the Braddock stamp. I thought it couldn't possibly have been advertised like that! So, I found the original listing on eBay and have added it below.
I see from the listing that the seller didn't even mention Braddock and made no feature of the stamp. So I suppose I'm minded to accept it as the genuine article.
As to the date of the card's making and use, I assume that Braddock did a clumsy cut and paste to make the article more saleable. (Believe it or not I didn't even notice the abundantly apparent mis-scaled man when I first looked at it!).
We have no evidence to suggest that Braddock was taking photos as early as 1876 and as you say the divided back suggests that the postcard was produced in the twentieth century. One possibility is that Braddock got the date accidentally or intentionally wrong: the other is that he used someone else's photo. My money is on the first option.
I suppose the postmark may simply indicate that in the wartime spirit of make-do-and-mend, thrifty KJ (KT?) took an old postcard out of her Bognor bureau and thought it amusant to send it 'back home'.
Good fine: a fascinating piece of the puzzle.
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PS Look what I found in my files. I have it named as Hornsey Church c188?. I'm assuming that's a descriptive title that I've added and not one that would have ceme with the photo. You can see where the photo's editor may have got the scale of the cut-and-pasted man from. But the small woman in the original looks right: the man looks a bit ridiculous.
The photo also explains the rather ugly and odd looking foreground. It was either added to the Braddock-stamped version or cut off the version I have. Again, I'd probably go with the first option.
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Permalink Reply by Geraldine on
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Very interesting. Most perceptive of you to note the mysterious irregularities.
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For info - Braddock was in Alexandra Road by 1890: that's a matter or record. The old church was left standing until 1927.
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Permalink Reply by John Shulver on
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All very fascinating and accompanied by usual in-depth detective work we have come to expect from HoL members. BUT.........standing aside and behind of Mister Cut-out, over his left shoulder appears to be a vision of an old lady. Wearing a darkish brimmed hat, the brim being in line with iron railing, waist length dark jacket and a light grey ballooned skirt. (Maybe helps to enlarge image). Looks quite a ghost like image, almost "witchy". Now further on from that, if that is a lady can we suppose that she has died and someone has cut out an image of her husband/whatever as a keepsake. Or visa versa ?? They are about same height taking into account he is standing slightly forward of her. AND might that be water in the foreground of photo ? It forms an irregular edge. I await torrents of abuse and humility but it is just a thought, putting it out there as one says.
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Check my original unadulterated version of the photo in the comments above. The old lady isn't a cut-out,
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No Hugh, I'm not saying that. The old lady appears on your original photo. Cut out gentleman has been added to that photo.
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A little more on this photo. Today I was at the Hornsey Historical Society about something completely different and whist I was there, I happened to notice an original copy of this postcard. It's part of a collection gifted by a chap named Edwin Monk, who died a few days short of his 99th birthday, after spending most of his life in Hornsey.
Monk was born in 1879 at 21 Devonshire Street (now Devonia Street) Islington. His father was a heraldic engraver, (an engraver of ornate lettering and heraldic devices). The Hornsey Historical Society information says he moved to Stroud Green aged 6. I have tracked him down to 35 Osian Road between 1887 and 1889. Then, shortly after his 10th birthday, the family moved to 154 Wightman Road (in old money 2 Stanley Villas, Wightman Road), just north of the junction with Seymour Road.
After he married in 1908, he moved out of his parent's Wightman Road home and rented a house at 50 Cranley Gardens Muswell Hill, where he stayed almost until the end of his life. By 1911, he was working as a clerk to an electrical supply company. By 1939, at the age of 60, he'd worked his way up to become the chief cashier.
Monk had a keen interest in Hornsey's history. In the early 1970s, as a nonagenarian, he wrote his memories of a Hornsey then long-gone In 1976, they were published as the Hornsey Historical Society's first book. He'd also collected postcards through his life, many of them Braddock's work, which he donated to the newly formed HHS. He added typed labels to the back of each card. Apparently he had a very sharp memory, but nonetheless we must allow for the possibility of human error.
On this card there is a hand-written note (I'm not sure of the author) which says
From a negative taken by A Braddock living at 8 Campsbourne (1911)
Beneath it, the typed label includes a reference to the photo showing the church in 1876. But I assume he simply took that from the date on the front of the card.
So, whilst this confirms that the card is probably a Braddock, it doesn't throw much light on the date. My opinion remains as above. I've still no idea where my unadulterated version comes from, It's not the one at the HHS.
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Cor, Braddock is the gift that keeps on giving! - and no doubt more little fascinating facts will emerge as time goes by.
Perhaps 50 Cranley Gardens is is at the far end of the houses in this pic, on the curve.
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