Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!
Council dimisses views of Blackboy Lane residents
Next week the corporate committee of Haringey Council will make a decision on the Blackboy Lane issue.
According to the report prepared for the committee, the majority of Blackboy Lane residents would prefer no change, However, the report states that this option has been dismissed.
It also says that the option to consider another name is dismissed - not because it's the right thing to do but simply because that wasn't what they said last time!
Below are the results of the second consultation along with the report's somewhat tortuous justification for dismissing the wishes of Blackboy Lane residents.
Of course, those of you who have been following this issue will have little faith in these consultation results. You will have leaned that the Council may have sought to swing the result the way it wanted by approaching select groups through the local Labour Party apparatus and asking them to reply to the consultation to support the name change.
So, there you go, no surprises here: that's how politics is done in Haringey these days.
For the record the author of this post has no objection to street renaming where the existing name clearly causes offence and where widespread support for the change can be proved.
Full text of the Blackboy Lane item in the Council report available here.
Tags for Forum Posts: blackboy lane name change, review on monuments, building place and street names
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Michael Anderson on
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A mix of 1, 2 and 3 bed flats so 3-400 people I would imagine
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I think the main difference is that it is what the people in the block wanted.
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Permalink Reply by Alan Stanton on
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I strongly agree, Michael.
My recipe for the new consultation.
Engage, inform and persuade residents. Not instruct and browbeat them. Give them as complete, fairly balanced, and accurate information as far as possible. Also at least partly in the main community languages - as Haringey used to do.
The aim should be for the Council to carry people along with them. Listening to what people say; and reading what they write - whether online or in the return forms. Or in an old fashioned letter if that's what they want to do.
All publicity officially issued can and should follow the relevant Government circular. Also carefully following the Supreme Court legal principles. Not versions of these which may please the current leadership - whoever it may be now or in the future.
Many years ago relatives of ours from Portsmouth, arriving at Tottenham Hale Station, were surprised to find themselves invited into a marquee and consulted about the future of Tottenham. The questions would have been a joke if they hadn't been biased nonsense used to endorse policy which the then Council leadership had already agreed.
Trust can take years to build and sometimes a few days or perhaps even a few minutes to break. Rebuilding can be even slower then years. That applies to local councils, businesses, and of course personal relationships.
It's time to start that rebuilding.
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Permalink Reply by K. E. Hubbard on
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This is a discussion about the renaming of Black Boy Lane and should remain so and I do not wish to follow the recent fashion for hi-jacking events for other purposes. If people think I am doing so please accept my apologies.
This situation seems to come from the exercise of unopposed power. This is common to both local & national government and all political parties are susceptible to it.
The fault lies partly in the divided society we live in with the various elements only taking notice of their peers. Also the failings of our democratic and social systems to cope with the modern changing world or people who think differently from them.
This is becoming a disaster in Central & Local Govt.
This is the advertising bit so if you want to go & make the tea please do.
We need to change the system by which we elect our local & national governments.
The North London Branch of Make Votes Matter meets monthly (currently Zoom) to campaign for electoral change specifically in the House of Commons (It is simpler that way). There are implications for local govt. as well.
Details are regularly placed in the "Events" listings on this site.
We have support from all political parties (incl. Brexit/Reform) the Conservatives via CAER, around 190 Constituency Labour Parties (incl. Hornsey & Wood Green) and most Labour voters.
Figures as diverse as Caroline Lucas, Nigel Farage and David Lammy support us.
Around 150-160 MPs in all.
This is important, many will be aware of the Govts. proposal to change Mayoral elections from PR to First Past the Post.
This trend will lead to more situations like BBL.
Two MVM members in I think Somerset, independently organised a referendum to restore their Local Authority to Govt. by committee rather than the recently adopted "Cabinet" style.
They got a good majority and to the credit of the Council they reverted to the committee form.
Things can be done.
End of Ad.
Please consider joining us, this behaviour cannot be allowed to continue.
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John D - Has K. E. Hubbard "hijacked the discussion" ?
I don't know K.E. and am not a member of Make Votes Matter (MVM). Maybe in the past I could have and now should pay attention to MVM? But I remain sceptical.
Though it also seems more than reasonable for K.E.Hubbard and others to draw attention to the shortcomings of our current system.
And perhaps K.E. and I - and others - might well agree that the current system brings us to the damaging and unnecessary shambles of the Black Boy Lane renaming consultation. Where it seems that the excessive power given to Council Leaders is no longer properly checked and balanced by the formal processes in and outside our elected Council. (Rather than by a few people raising objections.)
Personally I happen to think the sickness and stink and dysfunction in Haringey's current politics has many more causes than the lack of proportionality in how votes and electoral seats match up. But fair enough to K.E. Hubbard to tap us on the shoulder and say: "Please don't forget votes; that piece of the jigsaw is important."
And so it is. But not the only badly broken component in the Eatanswill system of Haringey wards, parties, selections, elections, cabinets and so-called Leaders and "cabinet" members.
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Permalink Reply by John D on
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I think he has. He starts by saying "This is a discussion about the renaming of Black Boy Lane" but thereafter doesn't mention Black Boy Lane or possible alternative names but instead draws attention to the faults of the current national and local electoral system and the merits of the Make Votes Matter arguments.
In spite of his disingenuous first paragraph, this is a blatant attempt to hijack the discussion for his own purposes.
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Permalink Reply by Sarah on
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I agree that the thread has been hijacked. But I would welcome a new thread to discuss electoral systems.
A correction - the system of voting for London Mayor is not PR, but the system for voting in the London Assembly is.
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I am sorry if people thought I was using this for another agenda. That was not the intention although on re- reading it there was a lot about one organisation.
I live a few streets away from BBL. When I crossed the lower end this morning the roadway was closed off.
Most of what I know about this comes from here. At first reading it looked as though any consultations were (quite reasonably) confined to the residents of BBL.
Other than this I saw a Petition on one of the on-line Petition Sites which had been withdrawn due to lack of support.
I now see that the consultation was wider, I did not see this probably because I was not looking for it.
My point in joining the discussion was to point out that there were many reasons for this situation arising. The Democratic System is an important one, "Absolute Power" etc.
Also the fragmentation of society. The tendency to only associate with people of the same socio-economic or political outlook. To only listen to people who will reinforce & confirm ones own views. This somewhat limits peoples outlook.
The combination of these and other faults seems to have led to this situation.
Ones attitude toward the actual renaming is largely subjective and would reflect ones own priorities.
There have been some very interesting comments on this.
As a ratepayer I am quite happy to deplore the cost and that it should be spent more productively.
A lot has to change in society to remedy these problems. I pointed out the actions of two private individuals who managed to change the procedures of their local council, so it can be done.
Also the attempt to change the Mayoral vote. [As a point of information these are by Supplementary Vote which is usually considered to be a form of PR. There are several, each of which have plus or minus points].
If this happens it could lead to other situations such as the BBL one.
If anyone was offended I am sorry, it was not the intention, I do have a small interest in this.
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Permalink Reply by Devon Williams on
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This got a mention in the Tottenham community paper. It seems Cllr Eldridge has his head screwed on right. Hopefully his views plus the objections of BBL residents will inject a bit of sense into the debate. As Cllr Eldridge says the proposal is a regressive step to a period of genuine racism. We live in comparatively enlightened times as evidenced by Tony Sewell's report released this week.
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C'mon, Devon. Now's the time for some bridge building and mutual respectful listening. At least with other local residents whose opinions differ from your own. There are many bridge builders who posted on this thread. There are win-win outcomes if we look for them.
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