Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!
Review of monuments, building, place and street names in Haringey
I know there's a great appreciation of local history in the Harringay Online community.
What do people think of this, then:
https://www.haringey.gov.uk/news/leader-statement-review-monuments-...
My thoughts: Rather than destroying historic landmarks or erasing names of buildings, places and streets, we can use them as a springboard for more rounded education.
For example, statues' podiums generally have 360 degrees or 4 sides, but just use a small portion to tell a tiny fraction of their story. We can use each statue's podium to tell more sides and degrees of their story. We can use the room around every street sign and name plate for further information giving more rounded and fuller information about history - both positive and negative.
Doing so will help us to de-idolise historical figures. It will help us to recognise that humans are more complicated than that. Hiding historic figures (and thus ourselves) from scandals and successes risks leaving us ignorant. That cannot be a good thing. Few if any historic figures have a completely clean record or reputation.
Admittedly, no story, however told, is complete. They can, however, be updated with facts over time. At a time when we see so much "fake news", more than ever, we need to focus on facts, and actively seek to avoid misinterpretations of history - either wilful or erroneous.
History is horrific. Being confronted with the horror helps us to avoid repeating the same mistakes of previous generations in the future. (An excellent example is Berlin's Topography of Terror, and various other installations identifying the terror that most of Germany experienced for most of the 20th Century.)
Out of sight, out of mind doesn't solve previous injustices or teach future generations. History and art is helpful when it's on our streets rather than masked by museums. Statues and other outdoor education installations are an important part of public access to education. The argument that they should be placed in museums concerns me. People from lower socio-economic groups visit museums far less than those from more advantaged groups. Removing street education will be a detriment.
This review is an opportunity to either increase ignorance or enhance education.
I hope it is used creatively for the latter.
Tags for Forum Posts: review on monuments, building place and street names
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Hugh on
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I'm not sure why that distinction matters. If the name adopted racist overtones and has carried them for a hundred and fifty years, it has become part of its identity. Given that and the offence it might cause to a significant number of people, we could just change it and move on.
I'm not sure if the Black Hope / Blackup name extended to include what is today Blackboy Lane. But one option might be to consider preserving one aspect of West Green's history at the cost of one that many might find offensive. We could always just rename Blackboy Lane to Black Hope Lane. - but please not Ejifor Drive!
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Permalink Reply by Brian Ahearne on
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I see the distinction as being one is fact and the other is misinterpretation/misunderstanding - even if it is a 150 year old mistake.
Fact is the basis for truth and reconciliation - something proven to be so important in resolving racist and bigoted disputes. If we labour under misunderstandings/misinterpretation/mistakes - or worse, if we accept or force others to accept misunderstandings/misinterpretations/mistakes as fact - then that maintains the disputes.
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I'm sure you're right, in a perfect world. But, given the world we live in, I wonder if the distinction you make is too esoteric.
So many roads have ben renamed without any fuss. I've already mentioned the previous names of West Green Road, the road at tha north end of Blackboy Lane. At the southern end, St Ann's Road was first Hanger Lane then Chisley Lane. The names live on, as do (some of) their histories). Hanger Lane was name for the great fields or hangers that lay to its south (I can't explain Chisley).
Air-brushing history is one thing; allowing change to happen whilst honouring the past is quite another.
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"It's not a perfect world", "life's not fair", "it is what it is" - all used to maintain unfairness by the powerful to the weak.
Let's at least try to aim for a perfect world.
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OK
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Permalink Reply by Christina Davis on
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OMG, don't even suggest it, Hugh. He just might you know! Ejiofor Drive - imagine.
However all our points might be moot now as completely coincidentally my daughter had a pick up for sharing app Olio on Blackboy Lane yesterday and I accompanied her. And to my incredulity - the street sign for Blackboy Lane from West Green Road is already GONE!!! I know it was there high up on the wall on the left hand side, I cycle down it fairly regularly and now it is just not...
So much for the review, consultation and then action. It's blooming gone already. So there is no indication for emergency vehicles, delivery drivers or anyone looking for that road that where they are standing is indeed Blackboy Lane. I was gobsmacked.
There is an old wooden sign right at the other end of the road but it is attached over someone's front door and involves going up their front garden and presumably that would need permission so that is still there.
Even I had to stop for a moment and think am I on the right road. It was only the sign on the building opposite which says Blackboy Buildings that told me I was not going slightly mad.
Strange times.
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Permalink Reply by Gordon T on
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Curious - looking on Google Street View back to 2008 I cannot see a street name sign on the side of the red-brick 4-storey building on the south-western corner of the junction. In 2008 there was a street-level sign on the building the other side of the West Green end of Black Boy Lane, but that has since gone.
There was a rectangular blue sign some years ago on the 4-storey building, now only the frame remains, but that was never the street name sign.
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I'd done the same as you, Gordon, but I'd missed the fact that the sign on the astern side of Black Boy Lane had survived up till 2008. Having looked now, I can see that to was there till at least July 2012, but not in July 2014.
I wonder why neither sign has ever been replaced? Has a decision of some sort already been taken?
There are now no signs at the northern end of the road at the junction with West Green Road, there's nothing opposite the junctions with Clarence and Cranleigh Roads and only one, on the eastern side of the road, at its southern end where it joins St Ann's Road. Bar that one, the only other that survives is a rather faded one on the front of a house opposite Abbotsford Road. (I couldn't see the old wooden one to which Christine referred).
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Can you imagine the twitter storm if Haringey replaced the sign... My guess that's why there's a default to 'leave it be'.
In any case, GPS mapping/Google Streetview renders physical road name signs only marginally useful these days.
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That's my guess, and as you can see from what I've written above, I don't disagree with renaming as a solution. But I'd rather these things happened a part of a through fact-based and transparent process.
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