Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!
Local Parties dismiss voters' sense of place
Those of you who've been reading the posts on the site for a while will know that I hold strong views about our sense of place in Harringay..........well in any place really. Our sense of history's part of that, our sense of community is a part and our name is part.
Back in April 2008, Nilgun Canver offered the following:
Today Justin Hinchcliffe, Chair of the Tottenham Tories joined in on Twitter with a tweet apparently ridiculing a voter's wish to have her place of residence recognised as Harringay:
What is it with our politicians. Don't they get it. Many of us simply don't wish to have our area chopped up and repackaged to suit their notions of political entities or boundaries. We have the right to choose - not you.
Are there any other representatives from the local blues and reds who'd care to share their views on this issue? And what of the local Liberals. We've heard nothing from you on this. We'd welcome hearing what you think.
Let me leave the last word to Thomas Burke, writing in 1921:
(See my posting in the history group for more on Burke)
Back in April 2008, Nilgun Canver offered the following:
We've discussed and we have agreed to call the area Harringay Green Lanes and Too much emphasis on Harringay confuses everyone with the borough Haringey and I’m afraid it refers to the Harringay ward and excludes the Gardens and other target areas.
Today Justin Hinchcliffe, Chair of the Tottenham Tories joined in on Twitter with a tweet apparently ridiculing a voter's wish to have her place of residence recognised as Harringay:
What is it with our politicians. Don't they get it. Many of us simply don't wish to have our area chopped up and repackaged to suit their notions of political entities or boundaries. We have the right to choose - not you.
Are there any other representatives from the local blues and reds who'd care to share their views on this issue? And what of the local Liberals. We've heard nothing from you on this. We'd welcome hearing what you think.
Let me leave the last word to Thomas Burke, writing in 1921:
But do you think the inhabitants of those villas will rank themselves with those of Tottenham or Hornsey? Not likely. They are of Harringay. The guide-book was right: it is a suburb with a distinct individuality of its own.
Proud of its lineage, proud of its appearance in thirteenth-century records, it declines to surrender its identity to those who claim lordship over it. Before Tottenham and Hornsey were, Harringay was so often mentioned in ancient documents as to receive the honour of being spelt in six different ways - sure proof of importance. Indeed, the name Hornsey came into currency only through a corruption of Haringhea and Haringey; and it is therefore fit that the stout fellows of Harringay should defend the style and identity of their venerable village from the encroachments of that modern upstart Hornsey.
(See my posting in the history group for more on Burke)
Tags for Forum Posts: harringay name
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Hugh on
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Thanks for the contribution Tom. Whilst I respect your right to a different opinion, I feel I ought to respond on a couple of your points:
All of these could be argued as a valid definition for where I live - how I choose to do that is up to me. I would expect politicians to be focused on the Ward boundaries.
- completely agree - which was where this whole debate started - with a local politician picking up a voter on that voter's choice of description of where they live.
the whole addressing him by the wrong name thing seems rather disrespectful...
- disrespectful? Not at all. It's satire Tom. The issue is about politicians choosing names for something that isn't theirs to name. Isn't that disrespectful? I think turning it round was fair game to make a point.
I find little in this debate to change my view that you'd have to be pretty brave to announce that you were a Tory on this forum
- not sure why you say this Tom. I started off even-handed in my disagreement with both blue and red and have made it clear that I stand ready to adopt the same opposition to yellow, green or whatever.
The name issue was equally directed at area renamers of both red and blue.
I've just reread others' comments and I can't see anything that's not essentially directed at the issues or in response to a previous posters comments. Never a man for detail, I may be missing something. Please point me in the right direction.
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Permalink Reply by John D on
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I agree with Tom's last post and I too had noted the snide comment about Kensington and Chelsea.
And perhaps this re-opens Hugh's thread about robust posting in general :-
I have found that I have only to venture an opinion on - (say ) cyclists going through red lights, bendy buses, signs advertising school fairs, - for those of a contrary opinion to vilify me as a hanging/flogging, baby-eating, petrol-head grinder of the faces of the poor who believes that single mothers are feather-bedded and deserve all they get.
I don't get upset about it because, after all, they are only words on a screen and I can comfort myself by counting the misused apostrophes, but certainly a sensitive newcomer would get the inpression that it's not a good idea to put the head above the parapet.
Before posting, a good rule is to ask yourself " would I say this to his/her face ? "
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Permalink Reply by StephenBln on
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Yes I would.. and there was nothing snide about K & C.. or Bendy Buses..
The comments were made to illustrate a 'certain' partys double standards..
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Permalink Reply by Alan Stanton on
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John D, just to say that I never thought you ate babies.
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Thanks John. It sounds like this is giving you some food for thought on the Civility & inclusiveness on HoL posting. Welcome any further contributions over on that post.
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I don't find it very civil to accuse people of making snide comments.. or for that matter, accusing me of not using environmentally friendly lightbulbs.. :o)
Still it's all water off a ducks back - sticks and stones etc.,
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Permalink Reply by Justin Hinchcliffe on
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Excellent post.
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And unfortunately, as seen here, leads to wars. Not always a good thing.
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Permalink Reply by Liz on
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Depends what your purpose in fostering civic pride or local pride is. If you do it, in order only to put yourself in opposition to others i.e. We over here don't like you over there because...then it is not a good thing.
However, if community self definition is used as a form of social action whereby people feel that their pride in their local heritage is valued both materially by restoring it and intangibly by listening and recording people's views on their neighbourhood, then it become a mechanism for change and improvement. The people in the next community then become partners by sharing ideas and learning from each other about how they have overcome obstacles. A councillors job in all this is to facilitate that action, work with other councillors to partner up and allow people to use their networks to bring about improvement. The trouble with partisan politics at local level is that it gets in the way of this as party loyalty and control often prevents those who do 'get it' from helping their communities successfully.
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Too often - and yes it's off-topic. So if you want a discussion on that, as I said to Clive, please open up another one elsewhere.
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Permalink Reply by Julie on
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Some of the politicians on here have been getting uppity with residents whose vote they might soon be asking for! At least they haven't concealed their true feelings in the interests of political expediency.
I would have thought it was impossible for anybody to object to local people building a sense of pride and community around the old name for the area. If snobbery, or distaste for places with bad reputations played any part in self-identifying as Harringay, surely people would have shied away from a homophone of Haringey.
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