Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!
UPDATE: RUBBISH AROUND TURNPIKE LANE
after 9 days of daily tweets, fixmystreet reports and emails, A Veolia employee was waiting for me on Thursday at the spot I have been twice daily tweeting (@itsafaff) a photo of the problem. Just one small example of a much wider problem in the borough.
He explained Frome Road is a collection point, collection schedules etc. The council have now closed the case and assume this is now resolved. But a conversation is not a resolution and to assume that it is speaks volumes about the council’s response to the problem. I wrote to CLLR Mallet today and below is the text of the email. It summarises activity over the last 10 days.
I picked the area around Turnpike Lane specifically because I go there every day, it is small and I wanted to focus on one example of a bigger problem. Get something done there and move on ... As others are doing with some success. Your advice, support appreciated.
· We need bins at the major collection points. There are bins outside Hornsey Station. I notice a difference in the services and facilities for the posher parts of the borough.
· We need these bins at Turnpike Lane/Westbury Avenue around the tube. Specifically Frome Road. There are many cafes in this area, more shops than around Hornsey Station. Stuart McNamara tweeted yesterday at 1pm that they will locate a bin where there is a similar problem, as a pilot – can you do this for us?
· We need Veolia to collect at the times it says it will – and not to neglect an area in the hope that no one will notice or be bothered to complain.
· We need more frequent collections.
Since I began making a fuss about the problem around Turnpike Lane tube station, this is what has happened:
· I leafleted 20 shops around the station. Discussed the problem with staff, managers and owners. Many were open and supportive. I have noticed that the supermarket and the taxi firm outside the station are now sweeping the pavement outside their shops daily.
· I have tweeted (@itsafaff) daily/timed photos of uncollected rubbish bags, specifically at the collection point at the end of Frome Road and used the app FixMyStreet to report it.
· A Veolia representative approached me there on Thursday morning to explain that it is a collection point and the collection should take place twice a day. They do not – not every day, my pics and tweets prove it.
· In 10 days tweeting and campaigning about this very tiny area – I have found that there are many people doing the same as me, who are not happy with the way Haringey Council and Veolia manage waste collection. IE piles of rubbish waiting at ‘collection points’ and insufficient collections.
· The Veolia rep told me that there are two collections daily – and two vans to do the job in the borough. Is this sufficient? Many people living and working in Haringey would say not.
· It is bad for business. There is a new gastro-style pub opening on Westbury Avenue (The Westbury)spending considerable amounts of money doing the place up – they support what We are doing and have tweeted that they don’t like the mounds of rubbish lining the street – especially the very big pile that often lies neglected on Frome Rd.
· The businesses around Turnpike Tube – whilst they are responsible for the bags because they generate the waste, don’t think the council collects often enough.
There remains a problem. Despite the response below – it is NOT resolved.
· Piles of rubbish bags sit at the end of Frome Road (and many other places in the borough) and remain uncollected for long periods of time. I have never once walked past this spot and not seen a pile of rubbish bags.
· The piles of bags encourage others to dump their waste. This is clear by the amount the piles grow, the black, and other bags that are added, and the other items dumped with them.
· This system of managing waste collection is failing the borough. It is unsanitary.
· The piles stain the pavement – badly. And leave a strong smell, especially in warm weather.
· I have seen rats, birds and foxes pulling the bags apart and spreading the rubbish.
Would you be kind enough to give me a proper response, one that will give me some faith that I am not dismissed as a nutter, that you take the issue seriously, that you will arrange for a bin at the collection point on Frome Road, that you will ensure that the service provided by Veolia meets need and that they carry out their contractual obligations.
Turnpike Lane tube station is a magnificent modernist building. Arriving in that hall is impressive. Coming out of it is not. This is one small thing that is within our power to change.
Jackie Chambers
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Gordon T on
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Another discussion, about translating the Haringey/Veolia recycling leaflet into other local languages, is relevant to this one. That Veolia leaflet does refer (briefly) to bulky items and how to get them taken way.
So does the 'Your recycling and waste service 2014/15' leaflet/calendar which was given out a couple of weeks ago (in our ladder road at least), though I wonder if it was one per letterbox so, as ever, HMOs don't get enough copies.....
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Permalink Reply by Takaokagiejin on
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Well I never, those cheeky boys who lived in my building lied to me - turns out Haringey would collect their vile brown plastic sofa at no charge, if they'd bothered to phone. So it's just plain rudeness then.
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Permalink Reply by Liz on
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They lied to you. Most people that do this kind of thing lie to themselves every day about why they do it, the part their own idleness plays in the problem and how it doesn't do any harm because someone else (in this case you) will sort it out.
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They probably lied to, but I'm unconvinced by the service.
I tried to use that service about a year ago to deal with a fridge. The next available slot was over a month away - "we're kinda busy this time of year" was the justification....
Not exactly a constructive policy when the jackass can rely on swift automatic garbage collection (ie. you calling it in) while the rest waits politely.
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Permalink Reply by Anna Maria Dipino on
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On my road not a day goes by where rubbish is regularly dumped.
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Permalink Reply by Lauren on
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I called in the afternoon and my sofa was collected the following day so maybe things have improved.
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So what to do?
Alan - I agree entirely and it is depressing. Makes me think anything we do is futile and want to give up. I don't know how to tackle the bigger issues anymore, the small stuff feels possible - but - I see this is also part of the problem and what prevents any real challenge to the systems and root causes.
Like Zoe says - if everyone here used fixmystreet or that Haringey app every time we see a pile - that'd be a hell of a lot of reports. It'd at least bugger up their statistics.
Abster, Julia and others are as fed up - or more - than me. Is it worth trying to plan together. So we co-ordinate. I see loads of individuals on twitter - but we are not really connected and co-ordinated. Would there be strength in co-ordinating? How would we do that? Old school meeting face to face? Identify some of the priorities for the things we want to change - focus on those only so the message is v clear and strong, discuss and come up with a plan to co-ordinate - something simple that we can all manage? What can we change?
Its the system Veolia use - bags on the street and timed collections - which is (one of) the problem(s). Often I find myself complaining or reporting something that is perfectly legit - I'd like to compare what systems other boroughs use - is it the same in Hackney or elsewhere? That'd show us some of the options. Does anyone know the answer to this?
Stakeholders? Who is with us? Which councillors? Cllr Mallett says I will have a reply to her passing on my request for a bin at Frome Rd in 10 days. The new pub - The Westbury already tweeted support. That's next Monday 6th October. I know businesses are part of the problem - but how cd we engage them. When I leafleted some said they supported me and were fed up with how bad the area around TP stn looked. I used the slogan 'Its bad for your business' ... If we cd find one or two who would buy in to the idea that if the area was better cared for - by them and the council - it might help a bit? What do you think?
Liz mentioned community clear ups - great. I'd love to see things like one hour in an evening or at a weekend where people in a street organised to sweep up outside so they would talk to each other and share in making it a bit nicer. Yes its the council's job - but people would be seen to be caring about the street (s).
Or something like those guerrilla gardeners ... we could descend on that filthy passage linking Westbury and TP tube and scrape up that bloody bird poo ...
Communication - education - absolutely. I didn't understand that the purple bags were only street cleaner rubbish - someone else didn't understand about free collections - or collection times - it's so flippin' complicated ... and impractical.
Lots of questions. Not a lot of action. I see people are fed up, have done it before, made no difference, change for a short while and then back to how it was before etc .... So do we just use HoL to moan and feel a bit better we are not alone. And twitter to blurt out our complaints once in a while ... the odd letter to a councillor and be fobbed off with a useless list of stuff we already know isn't working. Is it naïve to think anything more than this is possible? Should we set ourselves some little goals and go at them with determination? Its something we can do to patch things up - but not as Alan says to make any real lasting impact on the root causes ... I feel we made a bit of noise this week - but what to DO .... ?
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"Would there be strength in co-ordinating? "
It's the only way.
"How would we do that?"
You've started it already. Via a dedicated website/Twitter perhaps? I'll have a look.
This probably will take a long time to sort. Needs a West Green (ish) comittee like thing.
"I know businesses are part of the problem - but how cd we engage them."
Dialogue/education followed by (the threat of) boycott for the refuseniks?
Sustained, unrelenting pressure can work. Keep it legal though, or it could be construed as harrassment and counter productive.
Pick off trouble spots one by one. One patch at a time and maintain it. - don't spread yourself thinly
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Permalink Reply by Jacqui O'Beirne on
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I think a meet up would be good, everyone in one palce at teh same time coming with a plan of action.
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Yes, though some preliminary thinking (online) would be helpful so we can structure the conversation a little.
Just to put a stake in the ground:
- Need a focused home on the web. HOL is a great community, but the forum software is outdated and limiting. I'll have a look at something that can serve as a place to collaborate and discuss/organize.
- Meeting location, the Westbury would be a good spot, but it's being refurbed (anyone know when it opens?). Suggestions?
- Need contacts at the council to work with them, who has them (beyond the local councilors)?
- Need contacts with traders to work with them, who has already engaged them?
- Locations: lists of the dumping grounds, so we can triage and come up with a couple areas to focus on at first (start small).
- bring your ideas for action. What do you think will put a dent in this problem?
- Experience: anyone know of areas/resident committees that have solved this problem and how.
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Permalink Reply by Julia on
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I'd be up for a meeting, and agree the Westbury could be a good spot - on Twitter they said 'Site meeting today revealed we are on target and should be ready to open on Wed 8th. Food to be served by Sat 11th.'
I had begun to think about something online too - e.g. http://haringeyrubbish.tumblr.com/ - but it doesn't have to be that as I haven't had time to do anything with it yet and there are probably other/better options.
I think if everyone on Twitter uses #HaringeyRubbish (or something better if they can think of it) to tag any tweets then we can all keep up with things that way a bit.
I have some ideas for cheap things the council could do that could help - nothing rocket science - happy to share once I've had a moment to get them down on paper, which'll be a few days due to work and other commitments.
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or a co edited set of google docs that can be shared and edited so all can access? I live on Westbury Avenue so selfishly would be interested in sorting that and Frome road bin bit out first but happy to go with the majority! My day job is head of Digital Marketing at Dogs Trust so though not good on the ground happy to help with anything online if necessary! twitter @jacquiobeirne
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