Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!

HMO or possible Tardis for sale.

Three bedroom house for sale, Frobisher Road £779,950. Currently achieving approximately £59,160 rent per annum. http://www.zoopla.co.uk/for-sale/property/london/frobisher-road/
This 3 bedroom house contains;-
Studio 1:
15' 8" x 12' 6" (4.78m x 3.81m)
Kitchenette.
Self contained shower room.

Studio 2:
11' 5" x 10' 7" (3.48m x 3.23m)
Separate kitchenette.
Self contained shower room.

Studio 3:
13' 2" x 12' (4.01m x 3.66m)
Separate kitchenette.
Self contained shower room.

First Floor
First floor landing:
Access to loft

Studio 4:
11' 1" x 9' 6" (3.38m x 2.90m)
Kitchenette.
Self contained shower room.

Studio 5:
11' 7" x 9' 4" (3.53m x 2.84m)
Separate kitchenette.
Self contained shower room.

Studio 6:
15' 9" x 14' 2" (4.80m x 4.32m)
Separate kitchenette.
Self contained shower room.

Top Floor
Studio 7:
13' 2" x 12' (4.01m x 3.66m)
Kitchenette.
Self contained shower room.

This one house has been taking £5,000 in rent every month !!! With tenants paying £700/room pcm.
There needs to be a campaign for rent control and against greed.

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Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Alan Stanton on January 12, 2014 at 23:09

FPR, this page refers minimum standards and to licensing schemes. Why should that pose a problem?

I'm beginning to wonder if you have a genuine curiosity and concern about this issue and are trying to get your head around it.

I'd hate to think you were simply trolling.

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Permalink Reply by maggie on January 12, 2014 at 23:36

Reply to FPR , you say "Forgive if I'm wrong but I think their talking about banning HMO"s which cover both of what you are talking about" https://www.gov.uk/private-renting/houses-in-multiple-occupation
I am no expert but I do not think Haringey Council are banning HMOs at all but are licensing them so that they can try to control the excesses that we have been talking about i.e. over occupation, health and safety issues. I found the following from a quick look at Haringey Council website; http://www.haringey.gov.uk/index/housing_and_planning/housing/landl... "An HMO only requires a licence if: It comprises of 3 or more storeys, and It is occupied by 5 or more persons, living in 2 or more households." Housing Act 2004.
In addition to the above, HMOs in specified areas in Haringey could have an additional licence. In 2011 additional licensing was brought in for the 'ladder roads' to "compel landlords to comply with minimum standards and health and fire regulations. It also provides for the council to refuse a licence where a landlord is not thought fit." (Nilgun Canver, councillor) http://www.haringey.gov.uk/consultation-over-houses-in-multiple-occ... This has already been going for 2 years so it would be interesting to know how it has been working. The new scheme covers a/all bedsit or 'shared house' type HMOs occupied by three or more people in two or more households, including flats in multiple occupation b/certain pre-1991 Building Regulations conversions into self-contained units where the number of units exceeds the number of storeys c/all HMOs of three or more occupiers above shops.
This is from the website- a bit lengthy but worth reproducing;-"In order for a licence to be granted, the Council must be satisfied that the following requirements are met: a/the HMO must be reasonably suitable for occupation by a specified maximum number of households or persons (i.e. meet the required minimum standards), b/ the licence holder and manager must both be fit and proper persons, and c/ the proposed management arrangements for the house must be satisfactory. The required minimum standards for an HMO cover heating, washing facilities and WCs, kitchens, certain fire precautions and room sizes. The actual requirements will depend on the type and size of the HMO. If the property does not fully meet the standards, a licence may be issued with a condition attached that any necessary works are carried out within a reasonable time. In deciding whether an applicant and manager are fit and proper persons, the Council will have regard to whether they have: - committed offences involving fraud, dishonesty, violence, drugs or certain sexual offences, - practised unlawful discrimination on grounds of sex, colour, race, ethnic or national origins, or disability, or -contravened any provision of housing or landlord and tenant law. Licensing conditions will be imposed relating to the safety of gas and electrical supplies and appliances, furniture safety, smoke alarms and management standards."
I have no problem with the council trying to regulate HMOs in this way. Is it possible to check if a local HMO is compliant is wonder?

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Permalink Reply by maggie on January 13, 2014 at 1:01

Hi FPR, I'm a bit confused, you say "Forgive if I'm wrong but I think their talking about banning HMO"s" and then the reference to Michaels piece re "Restricted Conversion Areas", but this is nothing new that they are "talking about banning HMOs" as this has been in existence for ages, at least since 2006, and I think before that, and you say "what Harringay is proposing is going one step and banning HMO's from large areas's of Harringay and probably expanding that ban increasingly across the borough." however all of the areas you mention above are in this report of 2006
http://www.haringey.gov.uk/udp_2006_-_final_published_written_state...
Despite this we all know of more recent conversions to flats and to HMOs in this area, in far greater numbers than the stipulated 20%. And yes, as you say, the reason behind it was that "the infrastructure can't take anymore people".
Your link however https://www.gov.uk/private-renting/houses-in-multiple-occupation was about minimum standards and licensing schemes, hence my lengthy reply re that.

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Permalink Reply by Michael Anderson on January 13, 2014 at 6:33

As I've been quoted I thought I may as well jump in.

There is a role for HMOs in the housing stock as long as it is developed with consideration to the mix of tenures in an area and the infrastructure to support people living there.

When I moved to London in 1978 I lived in a series of bedsits, as they were called in those days, for about 4 years. Regulation was light in those days and swathes of London were solid bedsit land. A street I once lived in in Ladbrooke Grove was all bedsits bar one or two single family dwellings. It was mainly awful. Their accommodation was uniformly dreadful, we had an interesting variety of indoor wildlife. I could have been, and was, evicted on the whim of the landlord, usually when he wanted to put up the rent. The streets were solid lines of dustbins and rubbish.

My experience was the norm pre regulation days, not the exception, and many people, me included, spent a lot of the time looking for the next place to live in Loot magazine and newsagents windows as we all knew we had no rights to remain in the home we lived in.

Unregulated HMOs (and by that I don't just mean unregulated in the sense of security of tenure and safety but allowing the development of them without planning) made some parts of London no better than shanty towns. I shudder at the thought of the market being allowed to do this again as the main motivation is profit with people way down the list.

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Permalink Reply by Cecilia on January 14, 2014 at 12:59

another one here, closer to where I live:

http://www.zoopla.co.uk/for-sale/details/27813517?search_identifier...

how did they manage to fit 8 studios in there I don't know... and the overflowing bins at the front are a bit of a give away, aren't they?

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Permalink Reply by Michael Anderson on January 14, 2014 at 13:03

I have a friend who used to live in a house on Black Boy Lane identical to this one. He occupied the whole of the ground floor in a very modest 1 bed flat. How they fit 8 in here beggars belief.