Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!
Harringay (Green lanes Area) Transport Study
A letter just dropped through y door asking for feedback. Here is mine:
"I hope the council considers the permanent closure of Wightman Road. Gradually commuters and long-distance drivers are realising they need to either use alternative main roads, or switch to public transport or cycling. The study shows that residents overwhelmingly do not own a car (61%), and prefer public transport, walking or cycling for their commute (82%)."
Tags for Forum Posts: harringay traffic study, traffic
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Penny A on
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Yes. Filtering Wightman Road could not be done without other measures to improve traffic flow and pollution levels on Green Lanes. But the key point is why should Wightman Road/the Ladder be a sacrifice zone to 100's of thousands of commuting through traffic? Historic closures are being revisited as part of the Transport Consultant's Review which is for the FIRST time taking a holistic approach rather than the piecemeal change that has happened to date.
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Permalink Reply by andy h on
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Another long term resident - not on the ladder or gardens - and firmly in favour of reopening Wightman road.
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Permalink Reply by Esat Karahasan on
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What has been missed here is that I agree with you, I would love to see less traffic in Haringey, I also love very much so the quiet as brought to Wightman Road which I directly benefit from when sitting in my now silent office and typing reports. However on the other side I am also in a position where the services I carry out inspecting properties for rent or sale in the local area requires me to use a car, i.e. fac in the local area requires me to use a car, i in fact use the train to go to and from work and leave the company car at the office, so my impact on the traffic is minimal Valatta that the company car (Toyota IQ) is one within the lowest emissions category and has one of the smallest physical footprints earned by its clever design and compact size. so as you can see I am making the most of our transport links I am not driving to and from places for the sake of needing to get to them where other modes of transport could be used, I simply use the car and roads when necessary because of th equipment I need to carry. but what would I Know I'm just a classic Lind of our transport links I am not driving to and from places for the sake of needing to get to them where other modes of transport could be used but what would I Know I am just a classic NIMBY. So you are quite clearly attacking the wrong party here, I also don't have the time to read arrogant, ignorant comments and usually refrain but in this case it directly affects me and my business and livelihood. As I stated but you missed, I am on your side, I agree with your arguments and reasons with reason, though I have the sense to see the cause and effect and way up whether something is a good thing or would have a huge negative impact. So the ladders and Wightman will become a lovely conservation zone, but green lanes will turn into an a monster of a road! This is a classic case of a selfish decision to back off your nose to spite your face, my point is if you want to live somewhere with no traffic, quieter safer roads and the like you move to an area that offers that If where you live is unable to, you all talk as though haringey was ever different or as if we are ready as a city to adopt to be i haringey was ever different or as if we are ready as a city to adopt car free zones to the scale and affect being discussed. I would love to live life like the Jetsons but when nowhere near th I would love to live life like the Jetsons but when nowhere near!
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Permalink Reply by Sandi on
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Equally, there are many who are in favour of a longer term traffic reduction solution to Wightman, and surrounding areas. I live on the ladder too. I choose not to chime in not because I'm 'put off' but rather that the arguments have been put beautifully by others.
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Permalink Reply by Michael Anderson on
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So to take forward your argument, that if people don't like the traffic they should move, would that also apply to all of the areas around Green Lanes that have had measures put in to reduce through traffic? So that would be the thousands of people living in The Gardens, Harringay Road, Hermitage Road, south side of Finsbury Park, west of the railway in Stroud Green, Hornsey and Crouch End............
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Permalink Reply by JoeW on
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I apologise Esat, I misread your initial post this morning and assumed your were complaining about your drive/commute from Southgate to Wightman.
Btw I've met several Living Wightman campaigners and your characterisation of them as new-to-the-area yuppies who don't themselves drive is way off mark. Most have lived in the area for some time, and their days of upward mobility a distant memory. Most if not all of them drive. Most if not all have experienced the sometimes extreme inconvenience of longer journeys at certain times of day in both cars and buses, and are keen to see improvements to traffic flow in the surrounding area. But they are also experiencing a healthier, safer, cleaner and quieter place to live and believe that is worth the inconvenience. Many are also walking and/or cycling more, and trying to find different times of day to travel, and finding the inconvenience is often not so bad after all.
It sounds like you have weighed up the current peace and quiet of your Wightman office versus the inconvenience of your longer journeys to make property inspections, and come to the opposite conclusion. Fair enough, but it doesn't make the Living Wightman campaigners wrong.
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Again we have drawn the wrong conclusion, I'm simply arguing closing off wightman road is an over reaction from OK some new and some older residents, it would hurt not just my unimportant property inspection business but all the businesses on wightman road and green lanes and the wider local area, it would raise congestion and pollution to unacceptable levels elsewhere and affect north London in general. My point in relation to my business and journeys was to point out the increase in journey time, but many of you have tried to manipulate a lot of my points! It some times take over 20 minutes to get down Endymion road and onto green lanes whilst at worst traffic times before the closure this would never be more than 5 minutes. I am simply saying such a huge closure and the proposal of dumping our traffic elsewhere is wrong. I have said however I am all for introducing a decent proposal with foresight and consideration for all other than those wishing to extend there outdoor living and create a street party culture. Perhaps rather than drawing attacks you would realise that I am not alone and work together, to find proposals and solutions that give all a decent consideration.
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Apologies again Esat I am not trying to manipulate your points, just trying to see exactly where we agree and disagree. I think we both agree that the level of traffic on Wightman is unacceptable for a residential area - that is why you moved to Southgate. But you also think - and I think this view is not uncommon - that any attempt to reduce traffic on Wightman has an unacceptable consequence - "dumping the traffic elsewhere".
I don't believe that is an inevitable consequence, as there are plenty of measures which, if the political will is there, can be put in place both to reduce overall traffic and to improve the flow of the traffic that remains.
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I do agree the level is a little high perhaps and partially yes this is why I moved further into the suburbs where this is offered but then again this is also offered on the ladder roads and garden roads and more locations in Haringey. we must remember Wightman is a busy B road and removing it entirely is going to have the a knock on effect and this is totally inevitable, people haven't and won't just leave their cars and in some cases couldn't, this is not the solution. What you are talking about is a long term minset change and major developmental changes to the infrastructure of London and the transportation of people as a whole, a baby steps type programme, which doesn't call for full closures of major routes affecting half of the capital! When someone offers a sensible proposal I'd be very interested and supportive.
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Permalink Reply by Ben Adam Sohawon on
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OK. There seems to be a bit of a chunk missing here, so I'll have to put forward my perspective.
I grew up on Endymion Road, have lived here since the age of ten months, when my family moved here in 1980. In that time, I've seen a lot of changes, and I've seen Endymion Road get busier and more polluted. I really do want to support the Living Wightman campaign. Anything that makes peoples' lives better is obviously worthwhile.
But I can't; at least, not yet. Whether people on here want to acknowledge it or not, Endymion Road is getting worse for all its residents. I've read some of the proposals to compensate for the extra burden it'll have to take on if Wightman Road is permanently closed, and, quite frankly, there aren't really any that seem adequate. I'd like to see more ideas, because I'd rather Living Wightman got what they wanted if there is a real way to take the resultant pressure off Endymion Road.
I'm not particularly enthused by the (albeit few) snide responses to people expressing genuine concerns about how this closure will affect them, nor the rather holier-than-thou attitude towards people using cars. I am a big advocate of public transport, walking and cycling, and I make full use of them, always making sure the car is a last resort. However, I and my family DO need to use the car locally rather frequently; my parents are experiencing all the usual problems, and some not-so-usual ones, that come with advanced age. There are six of us living in a big house, which means the local shopping is quite hefty, and is done at various locations around Harringay. We have also had to do extensive repairs on our house, which requires that we transport a number of large and/or heavy items, frequently, to and from DIY outlets and the recycling centre near Alexandra Palace. None of this can be done via bicycle or walking.
Like I say, I'd like to see Living Wightman succeed, but only if there's a genuine effort to address the concerns of everyone living in Harringay, whom this site was set up to represent, and not if such success comes at the cost of people living on Endymion Road and Harringay Green Lanes, and certainly not if the only reactions people living in those areas are going to get from people involved with LW are non-committal at best, and smug and snotty at worst.
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Permalink Reply by Peter Chalk on
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A red route on Green Lanes would reduce the jams on Endymion but I agree a wider solution is needed such as an outer London congestion charge starting at the North Circular.
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