Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!
Green Lanes Area Transport Study - consultation
http://www.haringey.gov.uk/transport/green-lanes-area-transport-study
Tags for Forum Posts: consultation, harringay traffic study, traffic
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by JulieB on
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There is information from the consultants on pollution here: http://www.haringey.gov.uk/sites/haringeygovuk/files/existing_condi... from page 110 to 116.
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Permalink Reply by Nick on
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But streets which are purely residential in character - which all the rung roads are and Wightman road is for the vast majority of its length - just need to be protected from through-traffic.
Think carefully about how many roads in the area this would apply to.
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Permalink Reply by PeterPiper on
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Arthur Dent would probably have had a great deal of sympathy with the residents of Wightman Road and their desire to prevent their residential street from being turned into a motorway.
It is worth noting for residents of Green Lanes that currently there exists a powerful lobby from Green Lanes that does not wish to see any measures implemented that might remove parking from Green Lanes, some of whom I understand to be landlords of the properties along the street. These landlords are often not residents, but have business activities located there.
Whilst the driving force behind the area traffic study came from the long term residents of the Ladder, it was they who requested that any study should have a holistic basis, in direct contrast to previous consultations regarding traffic measures to the east of Green Lanes.
When the bollards were installed in the Gardens, the first that Ladder residents knew about them was after they were installed because they were not consulted and the same is true of the blocking of both Vale and Hermitage Roads.
During the Steering Committee meetings before the current consultation even started representatives were told that unblocking Hermitage Road or Vale Road was “off the table” and the same went for the Gardens.
I recommend that anyone interested in the issue should note whom the ward councillors are for the Seven Sisters Ward with covers Hermitage Road and Vale Road and also the names of all the councillors who were designated to sit on the Steering Group even if they never showed up. Just check the original minutes of the first meetings.
As for the status of Wightman Road being a ‘B’ road this is a relatively new designation and little consultation if any was undertaken at the time or publicised.
None of these small consultations considered any mitigation consideration at the time.
In have seen tail-backs along Green Lanes during the evening rush hour stretching back to Manor House purely on account of one vehicle being on on the Western side and no sign of enforcement let alone a tow-truck to remove the offending vehicle. Occasionally it might have attracted a parking ticket, but that is all.
I have the greatest sympathy for the residents of Green Lanes and the air pollution that exists, but Living Wightman & JoeW is not where ire should be directed, rather it should be directed at River Park House in Wood Green where there are elected people with power to bring about the changes that I think everybody wants.
The status quo is no longer tenable.
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I apologise for my mistake regarding the designation of Wightman road as a B road being only recent history.
I am sure you are correct that the consultation regarding the bollards in the Gardens was published, but where was it published?
Did it have the same widespread publicity that has been given to the current consultation? You seem to be quite the archivist, perhaps you can dig up an example of it's publication in your spare time to present to us all. Perhaps you could also present us with a list of the supporters and the objectors and also how long it lasted. For example were there any public meetings, exhibitions and expert analysis that were also provided at the time along the same lines as the current consultation?
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Permalink Reply by 1vut8bf3om5m9 on
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The key couple of words is "statutory consultations". That means the council would have to do what is prescribed by law. While the interest was fully alive and kicking in 2000, it is not unreasonable to presume that the "statutory consultations" even then could well have been what they were in e.g., 1956--basically something akin to hanging bills of notice at the perimeter, much like planning applications are publicised till this day.
I once started the proceedings to bankrupt a company. As part of the "statutory notice" it was necessary to publish notice of the proceedings in the Gazette. I expect you caught that advert when I published it.....
Do these sorts of things strike you as something akin the "widespread publicity that has been given to the current consultation"?
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Permalink Reply by JoeW on
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Interesting map - also shows how the Wightman/Turnpike and Turnpike/Hornsey Park Rd were two separate junctions before they were straightened out (and the entrance to Wightman widened to make it more inviting); and also how Mayes Road used to run into Wood Green High Road before the mall was built:
(click to enlarge, or browse the map here http://maps.nls.uk/view/102342269)
There are also a couple of old railway lines on the map, they went out of fashion for some reason (one to the West now Parklands Walk, the one to the East now streets).
I think the B classification of Wightman was in 1930, well before anyone had any idea of the volume of private motor vehicles that were to come.
The unfolding of history has dealt Wightman a pretty bad deal hasn't it? Will it fare any better when the Mall is demolished and a brave new Wood Green created? This map might give us a clue:
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Permalink Reply by John McMullan on
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Those landlords would have had plenty of space for loading their shops if "someone" hadn't built on the mews land in behind them (historical map of Harringay linked here to see the old mews). Very little sympathy and I wonder if the level of corruption that must have been involved in that process still exists in the council.
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Be careful what you wish for.
Hi Peter,
Re parking on green lanes, I'm happy for it to be removed if that's what you want .
But - example -
When the CPZ and speed cushions were installed on woodlands park they placed two cushions in the two traffic lanes to calm taffic, but neglected to place any in the parking bays. The result was cars traveling at 30-40 mph (seriously) in the parking bays inches away from us to avoid the cushions . That could be green lanes under your plan.
You have no idea how terrifying that was when walking on the pavement with young children and a car passing at that speed with no barriers what so ever. It wasn't until I dragged the council traffic boffins down on to our road to see for themselves (this took months by the way) that they had any idea what they'd done.
You may not like parking on the lanes, but if that's what you want make sure you have railings ( the ones that have just been removed) installed from the bridge to Turnpike Lane to separate us from speeding cars. Trust me, you'll need them.
Was it a year ago that a car took a left hand turn into cafe snug? No parking there BTW.
You may not like parked cars but they do provide a substantial barrier from arse holes. And trust me there are thousands of those.
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andy h,
That's why you also need segregated cycling lanes on Green Lanes - they provide that separation from motor traffic and greatly enhance the environment for pedestrians.
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Permalink Reply by Rich on
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I don't think there would be room for a cycle lane, bus lane and free flowing traffic. Recently I've been thinking having green lanes with no parking, bus lanes on either side (shared with cyclists) and one way. Problem is that would have to be part of a larger one way system (possibly W Green road). However this would likely have it's own set of problems which have been mentioned with relation to one way systems else where.
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I am more than happy, as are hundreds of other cyclists, to share the bus lane on Green Lanes in the morning with busses. I am not so happy to share it with the Iceland and Tesco delivery lorries which have to sit out the front there in the morning. It is not a red route so no motorcycles and black cabs undercuttiing the traffic at speed in the bus lane are rare.
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The road isn't wide enough for a bus lane either side. Anyway removing the parking, as often as its mentioned, is no panacea.
Some people don't actually want to cross 4 lanes of traffic - the parking actually benefits pedestrians by reducing the effective width of the road.
During the morning and evening rush hours, parking is already forbidden on the 'busy' side.
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