Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!
Fly tippers taking the mick....
Hi all,
Found those dumped clothes yday on Warham Road. Fly tippers really taking the mick here given that the warning sign is right above the pile. I think this picture exemplifies the council's failed policies and measures in dealing with this ongoing problem. I feel like things have gotten worse again in the last few weeks with more dumped rubbish on our streets. We made a push few months ago trying to address the problem. Maybe worth re-engaging with the council.
I hate having to walk along our streets and explaining to our children why there is so much rubbish on our streets.
Time for the council to act and step up their game.
Dominik
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Michael Anderson on
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This thread from July 2017 nicely sums up the issues (from page 4 onward). It was sent with a covering email to the then lead member for environment and not even an acknowledgement was received, never mind a response
https://www.harringayonline.com/forum/topics/a-rubbish-day-in-harri...
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And this is what I wrote
Dear Cllr Ahmet,
On Sunday 9 July a group of local residents photographed problems with street cleaning, rubbish dumping and general environmental issues in and around the Harringay Ladder. They posted these on Harringay On Line. The link to these photographs and comments start on page three. I would urge you to spend some time looking at these.
http://www.harringayonline.com/forum/topics/a-rubbish-day-in-harrin...
I think it is important to emphasise that all of these problems were spotted on one day, in some cases after only in an hour of walking around, in a very small geographical area.
You will see from reading the posts about rubbish and street cleaning that there is a great deal of discontent and anger about the state the area is in. While some of this can be blamed on the schedule and efficiency of rubbish collection, street cleaning and actioning environmental issues, there is also a broad acknowledgement that the root cause is the attitude to the local environment of some of those living in, trading in and visiting the area.
There seems to be a broad consensus amongst those who took part in this exercise and people commenting on the outcome of it that a definite, detailed action plan is drawn up to -
i). carry out an urgent intensive clear and clean of the area, including the paving on Green Lanes and Turnpike Lane
ii) follow this up with enforcement; actually knocking on doors to find out why bins are overflowing and stored on the footpath and what can be done about it, checking dumped rubbish to try to find out the identity of the dumpers, going to homes and businesses to ask what they know about rubbish left on their doorsteps
iII) plan how to prevent the area returning to its current state, including the role of Frontline staff in spotting, reporting and prosecuting littering and flytipping.
iv) let all of us in the area, residents and businesses, know what the plan of action is and how we are going to be kept informed about progress.
I, and some of the other who took part in this exercise, would be very happy to meet with you and our ward councillors to discuss the plan of action for the area and to have a positive dialogue about what other measures could be taken to improve the environment we live and work in.
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Permalink Reply by Mavic Starfish on
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Post holiday catch up, thanks for sending this on behalf of HoL, I look forward to the councillers response
thanks Glen
just realised you sent this 2 years ago, it's much much worse now
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What make me angry is that a bunch of local people got out there, went to the bother of gathering all of this information, made an offer to do some real work with Haringey to try to sort it out and all we got was silence.
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Permalink Reply by Alan Stanton on
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Do please have a look at the list of timed waste collections for businesses and flats above shops. (FAS)
There's a downloadable pdf file here.
https://www.haringey.gov.uk/environment-and-waste/rubbish-and-recyc...
It's called "Timed collections and special locations".In summary what the Council has permitted is officially sanctioned pavement/kerbside dumpsites. Theoretically these are restricted to two one hour slots - morning and evening/night to bring out the waste and dump it by the kerb. With two one hour slots for Veolia or other waste contractors to collect.
As most of us will guess, the stuff is likely to be left out or left uncollected beyond the permitted hours. And even if the traders, tenants above shops, and contractors strictly obey the time limits, the system "models" street dumping and is likely to attract casual additions throughout the day.
Unfortunately this "system" has not only been applied to main roads, but to what are known as "headings". In other words the corners near main roads and a short distance along nearby roads. Plus it appears there are some additional roads where the same "system" has been applied.
In one case in Cllr Joe Ejiofor's Bruce Grove ward it appears that a landlord has provided no space for rubbish to be stored. So there's a repeated row of bags leaking gloop on the pavement.
I suggest downloading the pdf file and see if your own nearby main streets are listed. I anticipate some nasty surprises for a lot of people who - like me - thought they were reporting so-called fly-tipping but were actually mistaking permitted Council-approved rubbishing the Borough.
I have no idea whether or not we civic minded residents have fly-topped-up the already dire Haringey dumping stats by reporting these "legal" waste piles. Or whether our reports have multiplied the clearances, cost the borough more, and encouraged further dumping.
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Permalink Reply by Hugh on
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Thanks for this, Alan. I was aware of the existence of this facility for Green Lanes (and, I'd assumed, other high streets). But I was surprised to also find on the list "the whole of":
- Wightman Road
- Alroy Road
- St Ann's Road
- Salisbury Road
Do you know if that only applies to commercial premises and flats above them on those roads?
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I don't know the answer, Hugh. I asked Cllr Zena Brabazon but she doesn't know either.
Nor can I find the answers on the Council website. Or on the timed waste collection signs I happen to have photographed.
Sometimes there are officially sanctioned mini-dumpsites which are the same locations as Council signs which picture - and threaten - those two blokes with crimson halos.
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Permalink Reply by Don on
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This was news to me, too. However, there's an obvious danger that it just exacerbates the problem - there's a notorious spot by the 341 bus stop opposite the Salisbury in St Ann's Road which always, always, has food waste, rubbish bags and domestic junk piled up against the (overflowing) rubbish bin at all hours of the day and night. It may or may not be an officially sanctioned dumpsite, but it's right next to the bus stop, close to a convenience shop and takeaway, and outside a row of flats-above-shops, so almost bound to attract a constant stream of rubbish, which is both horrid to look at and often spills across the pavement. if Veolia cleared it every hour it might be kept under control, but - once (or even twice) a day - no chance!
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It was worse than bad news to me, Don. When I see illegal rubbish dumping I've been reaching for my Canon. Only to discover that I've often been taking dozens of photos and reporting an official dumpsite.
Like the (in)famous Moorefield Road
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Permalink Reply by Bob Ruggles on
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As stated before there is the Environment Protect Act , which was brought in to Enforce keeping areas clear when Boroughs like Haringey was not able to Control Dumped Rubbish
The Only places allowed to put out Domestic Rubbish on footway is properties above Shops and that is very limited
As All domestic waste now has to be in wheelie bins
It is the responsibility of Local councils to make sure that All Trade premises has a Valid Waste Contractor . Failure should lead to Haringey issuing Fines
Currently aware that Veolia has Two Collection Trucks , Dustcart and a Grab Lorry for collecting Dumped rubbish and road sweepers purple bags. Working on two Shifts per day . Seven days a week . Which must be costing Millions
Aware that due to the numbers living in rooms and those not correctly registered as flats. Not everyone has enough waste Bin space. Especially in the growth of Fast food and resulting containers
But a good example of Joint Council & Police Services. Was as reported the other week When over 20 Joint Services personnel in Wood Green. Only managed to issue 6 notices
Worth checking if the Council can be prosecuted under the Act for failing to Sort Dumping issues
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When Haringey first contracted with Veolia the company sent us two thoughtful and intelligent senior people who seemed very well informed and keen to see changes and improvements. You may have met them, Bob Ruggles.
One thing they told us about was the high cost of collecting street dumping in a south London borough where they'd won the waste contract. My memory may not be reliable, but they talked about having trucks permanently going round and picking up the dumping- which cost millions. They saw shrinking this task as one way to make significant savings.
I've recently heard the suggestion that it's not the job of the waste contractors to do what you might call the "thinking" about waste management. My recollection of these Veolia staff suggests otherwise.
P.S. Liz Ixer also met them and may recall more.
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This WILL NOT GET FIXED unless heavy policing and fines are involved.
Yesterday, I spoke to an otehrwise perfectly 'nice little old lady' in my neck of the woods and asked why she had juyst put her rubbish two bags of rubbish where she put them...a good block or so from her house. She replied "Oh they will pick it up. You will see tomorrow it will be gone." I told her that she was fly tipping and she was adamant that she was not. She just did not get it! Then you have the professional flytippers who know exactly where to put there bulky items because they are always removed so these 'locations' become de facto regular collections points!
Unless we get a really agressive and heavy handed approach where wardens with powers wait in ambush i.e. hide, take photos and then apprehend the culprits in teh act, there will be NO PROGRESS. Unless this is done and the place becomes known for agressive fly tipping policing, fines and apprehensions, I am afraid...........NOTHING WILL CHANGE!
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