Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!
The Hell that is Wood Green
Yesterday, I had the misfortune to find myself in the shopping mall. Walking out the big automatic doors and into the crowd of Star Wars pub extras who were smoking, spitting and squabbling on the footpath I witnessed what for me sums up the whole carbuncle on the arse of Haringey that is Wood Green High Road. One of the characters stormed through the crowd with his status dog in tow. I was reflecting on the fact that ‘status’ dogs don't seem to work (as the people who have them only ever seem to be what everyone else in society would consider low status). Everything suddenly went quiet except the ever present sirens. The status dog had stopped and released its copious bowels all over the footpath. It was like turning on the light in an HMO; the cockroaches screamed and scattered. The dog owner laughed and walked on. It was probably one of the most disgusting things I have seen or smelt in London. Eventually the crowd returned and watched the next horde trample the mess up and down the road. There was no-one to turn to, no-one to clean up and more importantly no-one with the authority to challenge and/or shoot the dog owner. Things just returned to normal.
The whole experience made me think how the council, local police and traders believe that we're all animals if they are happy for us to have to deal with this every time we go to the High Road. It's easy enough for me to hop on a bus and head off to Crouch End or Islington or even Enfield to shop but if you're older or disabled and have trouble getting around or not enough money for the bus it must be pretty grim to face it every day. Imagine how the standard little old lady dreads heading out into the crowds, litter, phlegm, smoke and anti-social behaviour of Wood Green every morning to get the milk.
Short of manning water cannons at each end of the High Road and employing some mercenaries with batons to control the crowds, I don’t know what can be done. Are there any clever ‘nudges’ or interventions that could improve Wood Green? Is it a matter of tarting the place up and hoping that the crowds respect their new surroundings? Is it signage to remind, and in many instances educate, people that spitting, littering and barging into other people is just not the done thing? Or do we just give up, bulldoze the lot and install a waterhole in the middle and let the law of the jungle and the status dog owners prevail?
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Alan Stanton on
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A completely fair point, Clive.
Have you asked the ward councillors to help you confirm for certain which part of the Council is responsible for this strip of land? I assume the councillors are in touch with the local residents' associations as to their wishes and actions on this?
By the way, I notice on Google Street View that photos of this fence appear to show sections collapsed at some points. While other sections are a different colour - suggesting repairs were done. It shouldn't be too difficult to track who did it and who paid.
I agree that this response doesn't encourage individual residents to report problems. But it does show the value of having collective action and shared local knowledge - within local residents' and tenants' associations and on websites.
(Tottenham Hale ward councillor)
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Permalink Reply by Clive Carter on
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Alan thanks for responding. It was one of the existing councillors who told me that there is dispute over ownership of the problem.
I can believe there is internal argument, because the council's report it website did not and does not have a category for problems with fences.
Either this is an oversight or there is no Council Fences Department, or they are trying to discourage reports about broken fences – especially if the council does not have the resources to mend fencing.
I believe it may need a carpenter armed with nails and screws and a portable electric drill and screwdriver. Maybe a few bits of wood. I've got some spare if that would help.
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My personal view is that the mending of this broken fence ought not require consultation with residents or with their associations. I don't think it would be sensible to solicit their wishes on the subject. I can imagine their reaction would be: just get on and fix it!
What is needed is not a change or an improvement: it would be a repair.
My initial report was made last year on 6 September and it was five weeks later that I made another report via Fix-My-Street – on 16 October. (I'll send you the evidence privately).
Once a genuine problem has been received by the council, it needs to be followed through in order to maintain confidence in the reporting mechanism.
The use of websites is potentially efficient.
Disclosure:
am a prospective councillor candidate
Highgate Ward | Liberal Democrat Party
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Clive, I implore you, please don't imagine or assume in any way what local residents' associations may or may not think about their neighbourhood. That's how our Muswell Hill Colonial Administration currently treats Tottenham.
If you start that way, very soon nobody will be able to tell you apart from Kober, Goldberg, Strickland and all the other ignoramuses and mediocrities gathered around them.
Make a point of asking local residents. Talk to them. Listen to them. Respect them. "Solicit their views" (If you insist on using that slightly old fashioned phrase.) I'm sure you will find that's what the three current Highgate councillors have done and very successfully made it a point always to build links with local residents. As Humphrey Lyttleton might have said in your position : points mean votes.
(Tottenham Hale ward councillor)
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A section of fence has fallen down. Alan: it needs fixing. It shouldn't be difficult to solve.
Hillcrest estate tenants and leaseholders ought to be consulted about big things, like the council's plans to build another block on the Hillcrest car park. As a prospective candidate, I have been talking to them about big things.
Fixing a fence, on the other hand, should not require research, surveys, consultants or questionnaires. It's not what or how residents "think about their neighbourhood."
I suspect the repair would need a carpenter and standard equipment. I'm afraid I have already presumptuously speculated on the tools and materials that might be required. However, it isn't really rocket science.
Let's not wring hands about it or overdo the size of the challenge or think up reasons why the simple repair need be delayed. It appears that the council cannot agree which department should have responsibility for this straightfoward repair.
Any idea which council department's responsibility this problem might be please?
Disclosure:
am a prospective councillor candidate
Highgate Ward | Liberal Democrat Party
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Permalink Reply by Jamie To on
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Clive. Reality check. Haringey do not care (especially when run by Labour)! Like you stated above, you reported this on a number of occasions. They are more interested in the elections. Excuses excuses is all that you will hear. Another typical example
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Jamie, a few minutes ago I was listening to Fiona Shaw, the actor and director, talking on the radio about waiting and exploring the right solution - instead of reaching for the first and apparently obvious solution.
(Tottenham Hale ward councillor)
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Permalink Reply by L F T Snowflake on
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Great article, love the Star Wars check in - SOOOO TRUE!
You've kicked me into life. There has been a posting I have been meaning to do about Wood Green for months now. Just writing it now.
Cheers!
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Permalink Reply by Anette on
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Great post Osbawn, could not agree more. Wood Green is a proper sh**hole. Best avoided. Or bulldozed.
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Permalink Reply by Dominic on
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Completely agree with the majority of people that bulldozing is the best approach, although I think the people are probably the real problem... I'd take Crouch End, Muswell Hill or Highgate any day of the week.
As it is we end up exiled to Bluewater or Lakeside, eating out in Highgate, Crouch End, etc. and then we can't park when we get back home because of our street being the car park for Gokyuzu... (which could be worse, tbh, because Gokyuzu is a pretty decent restaurant)
Gentrification can't come quick enough. I won't be happy until over half the people walking down Green Lanes are wearing carrot jeans and scarves.
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To clarify; Noels Park is lovely, the only area I'd bulldoze is the high street. If that's any consolation? :)
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Permalink Reply by Liz on
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Indeed Laura. Go back a few years and you'll find posts and blogs (often by me) railing against litter, dog poo and dumping which was much worse here a few years ago. When I bought around here in 1998, I was met with such incredulity that I'd want to live somewhere so...so...(insert derogatory word or phrase). It's very important to fight your corner. Once upon a time, Harringay was described in such appalling terms on the COUNCIL website in 2009 that there was a demand to get it changed to one that didn't juxtapose ethnic diversity with violent crime and economic decline.
"Green Lanes, a very deprived area of Haringey, has in recent years experienced economic decline and some violent crime related to the drugs trade. It has a high number of Greek, Turkish and Kurdish immigrants and more recently an increasing number of Polish, Russian and Ukrainian residents. The main road of Green Lanes is an important centre for economic activity with mainly Greek and Turkish traders."
Places and our perceptions of them do change. Most of those folk complaining are stubbornly complaining about two things. The first is Shopping City which is there to stay - I can't see any money for a re-development to turn it into anything less 60s looking in the current climate, and maybe like other brutalist municipal architecture the generation after us will see it in a less negative light. After all, our parents' generation couldn't wait to pull down Victorian buildings which everyone swoons over now (despite some of them being hideous). It's my understanding that The Mall is a good employer and those shops provide work for a lot of people in an area where unemployment is high.
The other thing is more disturbing. The people there. Really? Have a good long look at where wanting to remove people that you don't like out of sight leads. It never ends well.
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