"We have a 'free' media with no recourse when it simply makes things up and a 'democratic' government enacting huge changes nobody voted for, a welfare state that will increasingly provide no welfare, a judicial system that is arbitrary and political, and a violent, corrupt police. So remind me again: why are we so desperate to cling to this deeply unsatisfactory system? So we can choose what colour car to buy?"
Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!
Furniture store being advertised for Queen's Head despite planning conditions
I've just picked up a tweet from John McMullan with the following text and picture:
Ha ha! Queen's Head Harringay kept as a pub... and I laughed and laughed and laughed.
My understanding is that planning permission was granted with provisos that included:
the applicant retain the use of the ground floor of the building as a public house. A feasibility study would have to be conducted using a team approved by the council if the applicant wanted to, in the future, change the use of the ground floor
At the very least, it appears that the developers are acting in bad faith.
I've been on the phone to planning and was told that the decision has yet to be published with these provisos.
Perhaps our councillors might intercede on this if possible.
Tags supplement: More conversations on this topic in the Friends of the Queen's Head Group
Tags for Forum Posts: queen's head
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Alan Stanton on
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William, let's assume you're correct and the politicians you criticise make exactly these calculations. (Although I'm not sure that the rest of the Tory and LibDem MPs would be quite so keen to have only a single term in Government.)
And let's assume that your scorn of "useless representative democracy" is justified.
In which case, I'm curious where exactly that leaves us. And what you suggest people should do? About Enforcement and Planning issues? Or about the Government's changes announced today? Or any other national policies which impinge - often seriously - on our lives?
Shrug their shoulders, turn inward, and "cultivate our gardens"? Simply accepting what's happening in the world outside because there's nothing to be done; and that two years of the Coalition is "irreversible"?
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Permalink Reply by William Booth on
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I am caught in this quandary, it's precisely as you say - where does it leave us? Depressed mainly. It needs an average of 37 hours work at minimum wage to pay for rent alone in Haringey; it's no wonder people don't have time to be engaged with the minutiae of planning issues. I find no 'green shoots' of good structural ideas among the main parties, it's all pathetic tinkering around the edges. I am completely switched off from parliamentary politics as are almost everyone I know who is young (ish) and seriously politically motivated.
It is a medium-term failure of the political class which has led to this impasse - an obsession with business-driven politics, 'the politics of the possible', the laughable notion of 'evidence-based politics' where the evidence can be commissioned, selected or rejected at will - and more generally the removal of ideas and transformative aims from the debate. All it has led to is the passing of the social democratic era and the inauguration of government *via* Capita/Serco.
Localism for planning? Maybe, but it will be down to people who have the means and connections to navigate the system. Localism for schools? No, they'll simply sack the board and put the school under direct control. You can't deal with arbitrary and uneven government like that without becoming exhausted and jaded. There is a whole generation of people slogging their guts out to oppose the myriad of huge 'reforms' going on and they are all getting ground down by the experience (at least the ones I know). It's like playing Whack-a-Mole, except the stake is you and your family's future. I expect the coalition are well aware of this and it's one reason why they are doing so much at once instead of sequentially.
It's plainly not going to be possible in a long term recession to rebuild a meaningful social democracy once it has been scrubbed out. The Labour party is being extremely cagey about committing to *any* reversals of current cuts. Managed decline and a long-term convergence with Chinese/Indian wages seems to be the only 'idea' - and putting up to two million people on workfare at £60 a week seems to be a serious nod in that direction.
Now, you may not be quite so at your wits' end over all this as I am, but just as a little illustration, I put the following on twitter a few minutes ago and got more followers faster than I ever have before - it's simply not a niche view anymore:
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Permalink Reply by Ruth on
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Our system of democracy has been creaking for years but the election of 2010 which resulted in this ConDem monster just about finished off any remaining respect I had for it.
People queueing to get into polling stations and then being shut out cus they were too busy, or just about to close... We should have had election observers as we send to so called 'underdeveloped' countries. It was a mess. It was unfair and undemocratic.
We got a government that was not voted for and hence high levels of alienation and feelings of being disenfranchised... we have been! No wonder people join Occupy movements and put up tents. Globalisation has probably made national governments irrelevant in many ways but they still have enough power to bully schools into becoming academies and make these cuts in social services.
I don't know what the answer is but I guess I won't give up on shouting out. And if needs be, in Chinese! I have a few useful phrases under my belt picked up during a major protest there in 1989, in Tiananmen Square.
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It is extremely alarming how much admiration and rehabilitation of Chinese authoritarian capitalism there has been among the business and political communities. Even things like Paxman on Newsnight visit there wandering around a factory going "look how hard they can work, with their 14 hour days!" as if that lifestyle wouldn''t be a *hugely* regressive step for Europe.
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Yes, it is very frightening indeed. Some workers are locked into their factories. They are modern day slaves. Is this our future? Many commentators seem to think it is...
Glad I am not young anymore as there are hard times ahead (well, they are already here...) Seems like we are going back to the 19th century. No social care, bring back the workhouse etc.
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Permalink Reply by StephenBln on
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Especially in the UK which wants to opt out of European restrictions on what employers can 'get away' with .. and deludes itself that it is on the right course. Not to mention voting against a tax on financial speculators, who have in principle tried to bribe governments to underwrite their operations, on the basis that if they can't get away with it in London, they'll go to Shanghai or whereverer. The UK government as the speculators friend
Thank goodness earlier British governments didn't use the same excuse when banning the slave trade.
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Permalink Reply by E. F. Salzman on
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William, Ruth et al,
I'm very interested in what you both say partiularly. William, what you say convinces me of the importance that voices like yours keep talking. (Then again, if it's all twitter I won't hear...!) I believe in the importance of activism, especially local activism, but feel so dispirited myself. The Occupy movement is the thing that's lifted my spirits most in terms of harbingers of change.
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Permalink Reply by John D on
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The following is taken from the Haringey Planning Website -
Planning Sub-Committee 14 November 2011 HGY/2011/1358
6.1 The application is for the use of the ground floor and basement floor
within one of the A use classes (A1 – Shops, A2 - Financial and
Professional Services,,A3 - Restaurants and cafés or A4 - Drinking
Establishments) The current authorised use of the ground is an A4
Drinking Establishments……….. Officers would point out that the
Use Classes Order 2005 allows the changes of A4 uses to A3, A2 or
A1 and as such control to prevent this spaces being used for other
such uses falls outside the scope of the Local Planning Authority’s
control.
7. CONCLUSION
7.1…….
. The authorised ground floor use of the subject site is
A4 and can be changed to an A1, A2 or A3 without the consent of the
Local Planning Authority. The proposal will not result in the loss of this
commercial/ retail space.
( my underlines )
So it seems that the planners cannot prevent change of use from pub to furniture shop.
Oddly, the Planning website does not show that the application received approval.
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Permalink Reply by John McMullan on
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Well this went well didn't it. They paved over the garden and it's probably making more as a car park. Nobody but an onsite "guardian" is living upstairs. They don't look to sell much furniture but I'm sure it's made for some great advertising back in Turkey.
Of all the things that happened on the high street in the last 10 years, this has been the worst by far.
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