Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!
Furniture store being advertised for Queen's Head despite planning conditions
I've just picked up a tweet from John McMullan with the following text and picture:
Ha ha! Queen's Head Harringay kept as a pub... and I laughed and laughed and laughed.
My understanding is that planning permission was granted with provisos that included:
the applicant retain the use of the ground floor of the building as a public house. A feasibility study would have to be conducted using a team approved by the council if the applicant wanted to, in the future, change the use of the ground floor
At the very least, it appears that the developers are acting in bad faith.
I've been on the phone to planning and was told that the decision has yet to be published with these provisos.
Perhaps our councillors might intercede on this if possible.
Tags supplement: More conversations on this topic in the Friends of the Queen's Head Group
Tags for Forum Posts: queen's head
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by 0rl8c48t1y284 on
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Dear EF Salzman,
You mention the want of a community space, but i dont get how you think this will work in the real world. Are you really expecting a private company to look at say property deals and implement a scheme which will create say substantially less return finactially, simply to better the community?
i find that really odd, as i have previously stated why are we expecting such things from private people when the council are selling off thier properties to the highest bidder which could easily be utilised as community spaces.
Why dot we tackle this point rather than go after the private person who is spending money in this poor econnomic climate.
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Permalink Reply by William Booth on
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Private persons spending money are part of the fabric of this poor economic climate. Investing money should not (in my humble opinion) be seen as an unequivocally moral act, whatever the state of the stock markets.
Equally, the real world is whatever we wish it to be. I accept we've allowed a rather Wild West-ish situation to grow in the sphere of business and planning, but it doesn't have to be that way...
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Oh I agree. But if both planning departments and transgressing businesses start feeling their seats warming up with public ire, then we might get the community and neighbourhood that we feel we deserve. A bit of outrage can get a community a long way.
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Permalink Reply by E. F. Salzman on
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I agree about tackling the point and also hearing what I said. I mentioned a pub or restaurant as two ideas and said nothing about a community space although personally I think neighborhoods benefit from more thought put into having these, including in tandem with business.
Which fits entirely with William B's point about private or business money. In the USA at the moment am hearing the vociferous defense by Republicans that pretending and extending tax breaks for corporations and wealthy businesses is very much to community's benefit precisely so they can use their money for jobs and to further society. Personally I don't buy this as in fact the history of the Bush tax cut years is that these people and businesses contributed to no new growth in jobs whatsoever.
Anyway, I'm assuming that some principle as regards UK would apply too. I simply don't buy either the way this was done, nor that any thought was put into how this business would work in this light and again I fully trust tehre is the talent and vision - on the part of business too - for this aspect to be taken into account as regards this site considering its hsitory and past use and the strength of feeling: if not a community or arts centre per se. I'm not naive enough to think this idea would have legs (alas) and am being practical in my points. Wanted to reply as what Iv'e said was twisted somewhat as per maybe a polarised view of such matters when I'm pretty open to ideas of all kinds.
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Permalink Reply by Paulie on
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The Salisbury wasn't failing two years ago when it was probably half as busy though, was it?! If it opened as a pub it would be used also by local ladder people who might not otherwise trek down to the Salisbury, as well as people looking for a welcome alternative to the Sally..
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I see +Rowan Cantuar (Peace Be Upon Him) is suggesting we start getting ready for our next riots. The Queen's Head is ideally located for a spot of late-night free-stuff shopping with ample off-road free parking for the most luxurious of take-away vehicles. Why shouldn't we all have a chance to access Pas(h)abahc(h)e or Kuetahya Porcelain - to relieve the boredom of JD Sportswear and 5-metre plasma screens ? Those Merino Rugs will go up a treat. All we need is the spark. (Sorry to have to spell it out on boring HOL - I've mislaid my BBM)
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Thanks for that, Matt. Good to see GLSG leading the Istanbul juri. Or was that another Nilgun?
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Oy gevult. Anyway, I return to my point well put elsewhere about thought on this matter not simply being a matter of morality nor that objections to this plan are necessarily objections any such business nor the overly simplistic interpretation of what might be seen as a community/arts centre. I'm not naive enough to think that something like this would wash but I'm quite certain it's possible to contribute culturally and socially to a neighborhood while likewise helping it economically, if the will is there. Apart from all this, this planning fiasco stinks to high heaven and I for one think it's important people be accountable especially as we as individuals would be for anything to do with homes, as was pointed out here rightly by others.
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The bigger picture emerging here is about who takes control for how our streets and built environment are shaped, changed, modified, enhanced, ruined.... and how much power we as residents, home owners, tenants, council tax payers, shop owners actually have. Whether or not the building (Queens Head) should or could be kept as a pub is an issue but beyond that it's about EVERY building and space around us and who has the final say on what it gets used for. Clearly many of us feel that we have been misled and our voices ignored, that the planning process is flawed and that we feel disempowered about the development of our community. LInks to history of the area have been ignored and again we feel that any heritage that could have been saved for the future has now gone from this building- similar can and will happen elsewhere. I know we cant all have a say on everything but there should be a democratic process about what we want around us (and this surely links in the excess betting shops theme.)
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Funnily enough there was a pub on Green Lanes - the Suffolk Punch - which is now a bookies (cue groans) and there is also a large modern extension to the building at the top of Downhills Way, at the junction of Lordship Lane, which is in use as a (wait for it) furniture showroom... It seems clear the way things are headed!
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Permalink Reply by Ruth on
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I remember it well and in its early years was a nice enough pub with food as well. A good local but it got ruined by crime/drugs etc. That used to be problem with Salisbury. Seems like now we are going to be seeing a glut of furniture shops as we have enough bookies.... I will stick to Disneys, affordable stuff, very helpful staff and free delivery.
Good bye Queens Head!
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