Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!
Questions for law enforcement re Womens Personal Safety in the area
Following a discussion with David Lammy's researcher Nora Mulready this afternoon about setting up a meeting with law enforcement around the issue of women's personal safety following the three rapes in recent months in the area, I have offered to collate questions for the police that can be passed on in preparation for the meeting.
So far I have picked up 12 clear questions from the Street Harrassment reports thread which are attached as a document
Questions for law enforcement2.doc
This document has now been sent on to David Lammy's office who will endeavour to get answers to our questions. We'll keep you posted.
UPDATED 8 March 2010
Questions
So far I have picked up 12 clear questions from the Street Harrassment reports thread which are attached as a document
Questions for law enforcement2.doc
This document has now been sent on to David Lammy's office who will endeavour to get answers to our questions. We'll keep you posted.
UPDATED 8 March 2010
Questions
Tags for Forum Posts: personal safety, women
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Liz on
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Okay, here's where we are with this so far.
The statement refers to the rapes and no, there will be no public meeting to discuss those incidents specifically as the police say they can really give out no more information on these ongoing investigations.
However, with reference to the the issues raised by our 12 questions, David Lammy's office will now write a formal letter to the police asking for answers to the questions we have posed. We will secure and publish any answers that we receive to those questions.
We can also push for one of the local SNT meetings to be dedicated wholly to the subject of women's safety. One or two women apart from Nora and I have indicated that they would like to be part of any meeting. Can you indicate here if you would like Nora to liaise with SNT and set up a meeting and whether you would commit to attend.
If we hear from a few more folk, we'll go ahead, if not we'll stick with securing answers to our questions via the route of formal letter from David Lammy's office only.
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Permalink Reply by John McMullan on
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Should we get a Harringay fund together for women forced to take cabs everywhere because the Met can't actually protect them on public transport?
Do you know how much it costs to adapt those buses for wheelchair access? And don't go kidding yourself thinking that it doubles for buggy access too, they would never have paid for that. Can you imagine the outcry if we told disabled people to get cabs?
Ladies, you pay taxes, where is the outrage?
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Permalink Reply by Laura W on
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I was seething quietly, John! But sadly,not surprised. As ever, the onus is on us to protect ourselves - by getting cabs door to door, not being out alone at night, and generally having to behave like scaredy wusses - and if something happens -well, what did we expect? Perhaps we weren't 'walking confidently' or something...
Someone fetch the smelling salts - & possibly the whalebone corsets as well.
I admit, I do quite often get cabs if it's well after midnight - but more down to convenience than safety - and of course I'll do what I can to keep myself safe and be alert etc,, am not an idiot. But as Andy points out there - most of us normal beings can't afford to get cabs everywhere all the time. So the solution is for us not to go out? Or to do late shifts? Or anything untoward?
Yeah, I agree. I'm disappointed with the response - we already knew all that.
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Permalink Reply by matt on
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It's election year. Crime mustn't be seen to be out of control. Perceptions need to be managed. Information controlled. HOL and the local newspapers kept on a leash. Information drip fed.
Bottom line is .... they've caught no one. We're no further forward 6 months ( half a year) down the line.
In Kensington you can be picked up for looking out of place. Everything is tightly controlled. Why, because the people demand it.
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Permalink Reply by andy mcquade on
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"Booking a cab to take you door to door guarantees that your trip will be insured and with a licensed driver in a licensed vehicle."
Also ensures that all women on a low wage will then no longer afford a night out -thus further lowering risk of assaults. Brilliant.
"These matters are being thoroughly investigated" Well, yes -of course, that's what you're paid for, but that doesn't tell us whether you've raised visible patrols or have plainclothed officers out there. This would go more to reassuring people than your advice that women take up martial arts and carry alarms.
Everything contained in this statement has been freely available here for a long while. Very disappointing indeed.
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Permalink Reply by Clive Carter on
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At least in the short term, the Borough Commander's suggestion seems like sensible advice to me. This is advice relevant for the next 24 hours and generally. The police inhabit the real world and this is practical advice.
I don't see the advice as remotely complacent, which seems to be implied. The police also have wives, mothers, sisters and daughters ... some are even women themselves! They will be keen to catch the wrongdoers. Some of the public might help themselves more if they tried to help the police instead of carping at them, or worse, advocating action that serves to make the police's difficult job, even more difficult.
It is common sense or at least common knowledge that some places and times are more risky than others. I wish it were otherwise. People need to take a minimum personal responsiblity for their own safety at all times. The affordability argument is perverse. There's lots of things I can't afford to do: but it doesn't mean I'll take foolish risks in spite of that.
Thank goodness the police are there to mitigate those risks. I hope the perpetrators are caught ASAP. Unfortunately crime has been around for thousands of years and is likely to continue.
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The police also have wives, mothers, sisters and daughters ... some are even women themselves!
And I bet if they lived around here we'd see a better response.
OK Clive, affordability argument is perverse for you because your lifestyle is different. Imagine yourself listening to a bunch of people with netbooks complaining about viruses and your advice to them is to get a mac.
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JOHN, you imply that the police will act effectively only when their own relations are involved. I think you should credit the police with a little more professionalism and even imagination than that.
As for computer viruses, not enough people understand (a) they have a choice of operating system and (b) the benefits of UNIX-class operating systems.
Individuals need to take personal responsibility for their lives, their lifestyles and their decisions – and not always blame others when their own choices lead to misadventure.
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Individuals need to take personal responsibility for their lives, their lifestyles and their decisions – and not always blame others when their own choices lead to misadventure.
Clive we're talking about women having been attacked. Who are they blaming for this happening Clive? Misadventure? What are you on about? Have you had a few too many sherries? You're on very shakey ground Clive.
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I'm referring to the unjustified criticism of the advice of the Borough Commander. In the meantime, the senior policeman's practical advice ought to be heeded. I'm sure he's not offering the adivce as an excuse not to catch the criminal/s or to delay catching them.
It's practial advice from someone who is serious about trying to protect the public. Of course I'm not blaming the women who've been attacked. It's about protecting women in the next 24 hours. I want to see the perpetrators arrested as much as anyone.
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"Individuals need to take personal responsibility for their lives, their lifestyles and their decisions – and not always blame others when their own choices lead to misadventure."
As in using public transport, you mean? Are you seriously implying that these women somehow deserved it?
And what of night workers -like my own partner -who because of her career path (striving to be an actress) has no choice but to work till the small hours as a waitress? Go on the dole and take benefits from her well-paid peers such as yourself?
You are saying that night workers take foolish risks because they are busting their guts to persue their dreams and goals during the day. Or that all women -regardless of their means -should find the money for taxis because our police are so utterly incompetent that they have failed to charge a single individual over three separate attacks.
You need to get out a bit more. Or in your case, only between the prescribed hours of personal responsibility.
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