Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!
The state of Finsbury Park
Who in the council should I contact about the state that parts of the park were left in after the Wireless festival? I really think there should be more accountability for restoring areas of ground that were badly damaged.
Tags for Forum Posts: finsbury park, finsbury park events
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Penguin on
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At the recent council elections, people voted Labour back in with a landslide victory I'm afraid and this is the result. Back to the bad old days of the park when it was left like this quite regularly.
You could try writing to the ward councillors directly but they are very arrogant at the moment.
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Permalink Reply by Zena Brabazon on
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Hi Maddy
You should contact Cllr Stuart McNamara who is the Council's Cabinet member for the environment. His brief includes Parks and also licensing. The state of the park should be of concern to both parks managers and also the licensing officers who will have had - or will have - a review and debriefing of how the event went. Bearing that in mind you could cc your email to Cllr Peray Ahmet who chairs the Regulatory Committee which includes licensing.
I suggest you copy in the lead officers for both services - parks and licensing. If you have pictures that would be excellent evidence.
Email addresses are:
Stuart.mcnamara@haringey.gov.uk
peray.ahmet@haringey.gov.uk
daliah.barrett@haringey.gov.uk - she is the Council's licensing officer
simon.farrow@haringey.gov.uk - he leads on parks and open spaces I think
Good luck
Zena
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Zena Brabazon
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Permalink Reply by Clive Carter on
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Good advice Zena.
I'd also suggest trying a local trio who are sometimes claimed to represent the views of residents to the council – rather than the other way around!
Councillor—Highgate Ward
Liberal Democrat Party
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Permalink Reply by Protheroe O'Shea on
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Might I suggest you video it and post to YouTube also send it to BBC London news. The constant damage of barbecues and litter, in my opinion needs to be addressed by the money made from the concerts.
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Hi Maddy,
Please get in contact.
We're meeting with Stuart (the cabinet member) and officers in a couple of weeks to look at all the feedback we've got from the concerts and any improvements that can be made for future events.
We'd appreciate your feedback and comments. I'll also make sure that after the meeting we let people know what is discussed/agreed.
thanks
Cllr James Ryan
James.ryan@haringey.gov.uk
07812 677710
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James - I, and many of my neighbours, sent various complaints to the customer service address given for the weekend of the last concert - will these be gathered by your group that is meeting? Also, you mention that you'll be looking at " any improvements that can be made for future events." This is really frustrating, as I've attended several council meetings where "improvements" were discussed (before the Stone Roses!! didn't notice any improvements there, and before Wireless, so OK, less urine in the school playground, but a host of other problems). You'll never be able to predict all the possible problems of having large scale concerts in park in a residential area. What should be discussed is reversing the recent events policy, and reducing the number and scale of the concerts (max 2 a year, of max 2 days each, with a limited hours of music each day - not 10 hours!, and a smaller capacity, taking up less of the park, and with shorter set up time).
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Permalink Reply by Chris Setz on
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I was at the recent Area Forum where the Friends of Finsbury Park asked this question of the senior Council Officer responsible for all Haringey's Parks. The Cabinet Member for the Environment was also there to address this issue among many, many others (he spoke uninterrupted for twenty minutes, covering practically everything in his brief).
Some of the points I hope I remember accurately from what the Officer said:
1) The amount of money raised by each event was a secret due to commercial confidence. I objected to this to no avail. It would apparently be a disaster if you and I knew how much each event earned because it would implicitly cause the Council to get less income from event organisers than openness would.
2) Finsbury Park costs £250,000 per year to run.
3) Over and above the £250,000, Finsbury Park earned £400,000 last year. This £400,000 went directly into the parks budget. So Finsbury Park is paying for improvements to other parks that are in dire need of help.
4) Event organisers effectively place a deposit with the Council so that, if they leave a mess behind, the cost of the cleanup is deducted from their deposit.
The Friends of Finsbury Park made the point that all this made the parks into a 'commercial surface' that earns money for the council at the unfair expense of the people living with the hell of it in nearby roads. The damage done by the events and their special needs changes the nature of the parks.
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As usual, it seems to me that most people simply do not have a clue as to what is going on and do not seem to want to even think for a moment about the issues. The kneejerk reaction seems to always be, 'blame the Council' and that includes direct personal attacks on Councillors. Whilst I'm tempted to blame the Lib Dems led by Lynne Featherstone for dumping this horrible spleen on our fine borough for cynical political gain, the responsibility lies with us.
First, whatever we think of Councillors, it is Council Officers who do the work. There seems to be this constant playing of the man not the ball. The Officers are trained professionals. They do a better job than we could. They are well trained and work in teams. They have years and years of cumulative experience of the actual reality of what happens here - not folk memory. They have professional competence which is why they are employed - these jobs simply cannot be done by anyone off the street. A glance at any of the regulations they must abide by at local regional, national and European level shows that it really is not that simple. The detailed plans they draw up for even the smallest thing speak to the meticulous nature of most activities. They aim to be fully protected against any criticism. They actually listen, if only to protect their backs. The ones I've met (and I've met a fair few) genuinely seem to care about their work, and, by implication, about us.
So, just to hammer home the point, what would you do? Here's a quiz!
1) Some of Haringey's parks are dangerous - there are gangs, there is drug dealing. If the Council do not act there will be blood. Parks in one of the greenest boroughs in London are amongst the most important amenity we possess and bring measurable good to everyone who lives here. They are important.
2) We have a vindictive right-wing government who are intent on punishing the poor for being poor with a totally unnecessary 'austerity' that cost more than the total 'savings'. The ConDems try to hit the poorest Labour boroughs hardest for political gain. As a Haringey Councillor, you are forced by law to implement £90m of cuts this year alone, on top of the larger amount you cut last year, reaching total cuts of 40% in some core services. The 75% cut in youth services did not cause the 2011 riots, but it might have done. The consequences of cuts are not abstract - they directly affect lives.
Meanwhile around one quarter of the £334Bn public sector budget at last count is hived off to those true friends of Con-Dem government - private, largely foreign-owned companies paying the least tax such as G4S, Capita, Veolia and ATOS at the much higher price we're forced to pay them. Veolia's turnover for instance has rocketed from a mere €30Bn in 2012 the more entrenched they become.
How do you balance the right residents have to enjoy a peaceful long weekend uninterrupted by the upheaval the Festivals cause with the need for revenue to keep the parks available to those same residents and the rest of us?
Do you stop/curtail events in Finsbury Park at the expense of the rest of the borough or not?
Welcome to politics!
What gives you the right to make these decisions on behalf of the 250,000 people who live here and what should those who disagree with you do? You need to be elected, that's all. It's not a great system, but it's the one we've got. We gave the power to Cllrs to make decisions for us. Complaining when they do what we asked is almost a philosophical nicety - the point is to change it. We get the government we deserve.
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Permalink Reply by tigha on
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having just come back from a festival- where no glass was allowed to be taken into the grounds and seems to be the rule for most festivals- surely 1 easy change would be to ensure bag searches for glass- if they can stop 30, 000 people at festivals doing that- cant be too difficult to enforce
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If only it was that easy!
What about the many people who complain that we live in a police state? What about the cost of all those searches and the problems of the bottleneck if people have to be stopped and searched?
I have often, maybe like you, come up with what seems like a good idea only to find that, when faced with an experienced operator, there are things we would never have thought of. I know it sounds like I'm criticising but I'm not. I have found that they have a lot of calls on their resources and have to make judgement calls as to how to spend it.
What people don't sometimes hear is the person doing the job who answers, 'don't you think we haven't thought of that'?
It's almost as if we think that the people doing this work are somehow inexperienced idiots who, unless we scrutinise them, will ruin everything through ignorant incompetence- I know you almost certainly don't think that, I'm not getting at you, but do you see what I mean?
How have we let it appear that we, the people who live in the borough they serve, think that all 3800 people who work for Haringey Council are reprehensible? Why don't we change the culture to one of active support and gratitude towards people who we are paying to do a good job for us in the public service?
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Permalink Reply by John McMullan on
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Oh come now, as soon as the sh1t hits the fan a politician will point the finger at a council officer. How are we supposed to react to that?
PS You can take a bottle of wine per person into Lords. I'm just saying that maybe it's not the park or the festivals that are the problem but the kind of people who attend them...
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I think you are reinforcing my general point about how counter-productive it is to create a system that we spend loads of time moaning about because it's broken. It's broken, let's get over it. Who's fault is it that it's broken? Why, it's our fault!
Councillor turns out to be so full of human failings that (s)he does something legal but awful - we moan like hell about the system whereby you don't need any qualifications to get elected but when it comes to voting, forget all that, don't bother to even postal vote and jump on the next opportunity to carp and cavill.
It's almost as if we were crying out for bread and circuses...
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i go to festivals quite often, ws at ridgeway park last week in chingford, glass is always banned,and bag searches take care, just as people tickets get checked- doesnt take long- people expect it, lot easier than all the workers needed to clear up the glass
I cant actually believe finsbury park isnt doing this when it happens everywhere else and festival goers are prepared for it, if informed before
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