Harringay online

Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!

I'm not sure whether this has been shared elsewhere on HOL - can't see it in a search but...

We have recently received a note through our front door that the St Ann's Low Traffic Neighbourhood will be implemented on 22 August.

This is a heads-up for anyone living in or driving through the area between West Green Road and St Ann's Road.  There will no longer be a direct route between the two major roads unless you are a bus or have a 'X2' exemption pass. 

Woodlands Park Road, Black Boy Lane, Cornwall Road and Avenue Road will all be closed to through traffic. 

The restriction points will be monitored by CCTV, so no doubt LBH will be issuing lots of PCNs!  Drivers beware!

I attach two documents, one a map of the area showing the traffic cells as they will be after implementation, and the other the supporting document.

Tags for Forum Posts: low traffic neighbourhoods, st anns ltn, traffic

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Andrew AW1 — Replying to a query last December, Cllr Hakata said that “a programme to address Green Lanes” would be complete before the LTN started. There were no other details. I’ve written again to Cllr Hakata and to Ann Cunningham, the council’s highways supremo, to ask why nothing has been done, so far without response. It seems that the GLA money that’s funded this scheme was time-limited, and if Haringey hadn’t put in the flowerpots and CCTV by this month they’d have lost the dosh, so I’m guessing they rushed into a half-cocked scheme even though they hadn’t put any of the necessary mitigation in place beforehand. It’s just like having to do roadworks in March every year to use up the budget that can’t be rolled over after 5 April.

Thanks. Where did he say that, as I say I'd like to know more about what was being suggested?

Did he mean a programme as in the physical interventions, restrictions, etc would actually be in place (this seems unlikely as it would have probably pushed more traffic onto roads like Wightman, Black Boy Lane, etc) or a programme as in a plan as to what was going to be done (which I don't think has happened either but some of those more involved with the Harringay plan may know more).

I wouldn't describe the current schemes as rushed, they've been at least 18 months in the planning. If anything progress has been slow.

I'm sorry. You are right, Sam. I spoke too soon. Harringay Rd has been rammed for the last two afternoons and early evenings. It's not helped by the blockage of Colina Rd. I really feel for the poor people living on those roads.

Someone recently wrote on this link that 95% of the traffic blocking our newly liberated roads is cars. This seemed extreme to me so I thought I might do some ad hoc research on the street. Today at 8.45 am approx I walked from Stanley Road to Black Boy Lane alongside the traffic jam on West Green Road. I counted the vehicles I passed trying to get to Green Lanes. The figures were as follows,

Buses                    9

Vans and lorries   52

Cars                     53.

So there you have a rough rule of thumb. About 45% of the traffic is made up of cars. Whether those journeys are "essential" or not depends upon your viewpoint and whatever metrics you care to use. I assume Haringey Council did nothing to determine what the traffic flows through the Borough consist of but clearly the LTN is having a very bad impact on air quality on the so called boundary roads and the delays to commercial vehicles will be hitting economic activity.

No-one today was being anti-social on the 41 bus but the driver was very peed off with the disruption to his route. Some 41's were terminating at Crouch End rather than Archway in order that they could get a turnaround of buses coming back the other way to Tottenham Hale. So even the Crouch End to Archway part of the Borough is suffering from the LTN inspired traffic jams.

Does anyone in the Council, officers or elected representatives, understand what they have done?

jp — Truncation of buses was also a big feature of the notorious Wightman Road closure, with 29s and 141s turned back at the Salisbury. I suspect this enabled TfL to claim that journeys in GL hadn’t been delayed as much as users experienced, because truncated journeys (by definition) wouldn’t have featured in stats for journeys completed. And no, nobody from the council appears to give a toss about buses or have learnt anything from the Wightman debacle.

Also lots of the East West buses too, stopped short or cancelled.

"Why cant people just walk to the Whittington? And this is proof of evaporation."

 - Cllr Cy Clist

Obviously it depends where and when you count. The traffic making up the queue at the Carlingford/Green Lanes appears to be mainly cars (16 cars and 2 vans this morning).

I'd assume the additional traffic is all vans and cars, I wonder how much extra of each? West Green Rd featured heavily in the monitoring with multiple counts on the road and also the Vivacity(?) cameras which should do ongoing monitoring including the types of vehicles so there should be some hard data coming out of this at least. I suspect the ATCs can't distinguish between vans and cars but maybe the cameras can.

AndrewAW1 — Software limitations mean I can’t reply to your query about the GL plan in the right place in the thread. Cllr Hakata responded to a query I raised with him when he was still one of my ward councillors, but gave no information as to whether he meant “a plan” (theoretical) or physical changes to GL. As I said, I’ve written to both him and Ann Cunningham for clarification now that the LTN has started, but so far with no response. I described it as “rushed” because it’s evident that no mitigation measures were in place, publicity and signage have been lamentable until now, and the consultation wasn’t about the principles of traffic control (alternatives to a full-on LTN) but only about the degrees of road closure being imposed, presumably under pressure from the GLA, which would only fund LTNs. If Haringey is as cash-strapped as most councils, they will have known they had to impose the LTN by the GLA deadline or not get the money at all, as delay would have cost their budget instead. The council’s minutes last year made clear that the whole scheme was predicated on the council not having to pay for it itself, so I’m also not sure why they can afford to delay the West Green LTN, unless they think the likely PR and reputational damage outweighs the potential cost penalty.

Thanks, I suspect it was probably a plan as in theoretical but it would still be good to see what is planned for Green Lanes, I've heard a variety of (at times contradictory) plans but it is an area that needs sorting. Realistically I'm not sure how soon it will happen though, I don't think (although I may be wrong) that Harringay is in the next batch and you can't deal with Green Lanes without also looking at Wightman at the same time.

Ah yes, I would certainly agree that the final implementation appears rushed, or just poorly planned.

The council solution does seem to be fairly LTN focused but I'm not sure that anyone has really come up with other realistic options.

I see the Bruce Grove/West Green LTN has been delayed to date unknown to allow the council to actually do some publicity in advance.

When does the Bruce Grove LTN start please? I don’t have Twitter, so the link doesn’t work.

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