Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!
People coming to door offering free loft insulation from the Council
A young man came to my door in Hewitt Road a few minutes ago, he mentioned the council and that I may be entitled to free loft insulation, but said I would need someone to inspect my loft. I asked him for his ID. He said he was a trainee and didn't have one but was working with surveyors who were up the road and could go and get them in a couple of minutes but they would have to come and inspect my loft. I said I'm not speaking to anyone without ID, and closed the door.
If he/they are asking for access to people's homes, someone may believe them and let them in.
Tags for Forum Posts: insulation, scam, solar electricity
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by JulieB on
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We've just had two strange people doing the same thing, I'm on Conway Road.
It was a mid-twenties women with mid brown curly hair, she was wearing a yellow high visibility vest and had an ID round her neck. But I didn't recognise the logo and the writing was tiny. The man looked Mediterranean with a very shaped thin beard and was wearing a light grey suit. He was maybe early-mid 30s. They just looked wrong - like they had tried to dress up to look official but had failed really badly.
They asked me if my grant for loft insulation had come through and just said, 'we're fine thankyou' and shut the door, the man kept trying to talk/shout asking me when the grant had come through.
They went next door and a couple of minutes later my neighbour sort of chased them away from his door and shouted at them to go away (but in less polite words).
I remembered reading about this sort of (possible) scam on here and it must have stuck in my mind so thank you HOL.
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Permalink Reply by RNM on
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Hello,
We had this too on Thursday. My mum answered the door so I can't tell you more description wise than he was young, casually dressed and polite. But when she asked for paperwork, he had none. She asked: "Not even a leaflet?" and he said no. Then she asked for a web address so she could read more about it and he said there wasn't one. Finally, she suggested he come back the next day when my husband was there all day to chat to him. He then said he couldn't cone any other day and headed off.
There may well be genuine people out offering this but I would have expected a leaflet or offer to come back if so. If this was genuine, I don't know what the guy would have been able to tell us as his information is apparently so top-secret it isn't online, on leaflets or available for more than one afternoon in May. So I find it hard to believe this particular caller would have helped me get a grant.
With that in mind, we didn't let him in to check out our loft. Or our TV.
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Permalink Reply by Germana on
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sound like you did the right thing....even if it was a genuine salesperson I wouldn't trust a company that is not able to produce an information leaflet. We had someone ringing our door last weekend - from Miller Pattison. He had a leaflet...and did seem genuine. We then did a bit of online research and the reviews of this company are mixed.
In any case I told him that as the police are warning people to be careful about con artists, this cold calling will just not work and it is irresponsible because it may actually be encouraging the criminals to go door to door. He pretended to be very surprised that we had never received any information in advance.
I am now thinking that there are genuine companies like this one who are however behaving irresponsibly by telling both the police and residents that they are NOT going to cold call but then they do. This is a good enough reason for me not to trust their professional standards.
However, I would still encourage people to get their loft insulated! When I get the time I'll try to post some information on how to get this done - and anyone who has recently done so and taken advantage of the grant they could also share the info. It would be great if the Council did a better job of informing people too.
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Permalink Reply by pamish on
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If I was going to try out this scam, I would make sure I had a good stash of leaflets first. I'd even read them, so I could sound knowledgeable.
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I've tried to gather some information - unfortunately even for someone like me who works in the field it gets extremely confusing...
Here is some useful background from the Energy Savings Trust which also has a useful search tool that helps you figure out if you are eligible for any grants and another more general one for a home energy check. I understand most of the grants are available to people over 70 and people who are on certain benefits but there may be more schemes out there and it varies from Council to council (again - some info from Haringey Council would be useful indeed, I can't find much up to date info on their website).
But in any case it is worth for others - not eligible for grants - to consider making efficiency improvements anyway because they will save money on energy bills. I think the first step for anyone (including anyone who has already let one of the door-to-door companies in the home to inspect the house) is to call the EST (0800 512 012) for more impartial advice than the commercially minded salespeople who come to the door. And then perhaps get more than one quote, calling other companies included your own gas or electricity supplier.
Beyond energy efficiency, which should be the first step to take, at the moment installing Photovoltaic solar panels is basically a very good investment: provided you have the cash for the installation you will then be paid for the spare electricity you may produce and effectively "sell back" to the grid, potentially making thousands of Pounds.
There are also companies who will install solar PV for free if you can't pay the cost upfront, but then you may not be getting as good a deal because they will own your solar panels rather than you. Again, worth getting various quotes and not trusting door to door salespeople (my hunch is that some of the ones coming around will be trying to persuade people to install solar if they are not eligible for energy efficiency grants....but it's worth researching the options a bit before accepting the first company who shows up at the door).
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On loft insulation - could do with some feedback scores. My neighbour (in N15) followed up the freebie deal. They made a pigs ear of it, just bunged down some not very thick fibreglass matting and left. He had to take it all up and do it properly himself. They left his old fibreglass for him to dispose of, which for a somewhat toxic material seems odd. Total saving, about thirty quid for materials. Cost/loss of time, masses. I don't know what the company was, will try to find out.
No local reference = no entry.
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sounds terrible - which company was it?
We have certainly found similar stories about one of the companies I mentioned above, but they are online reviews and we can't verify them. I would probably go for a large and well known company instead - unless there are recommendations from other local people on one of the smaller ones.
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Permalink Reply by Hugh on
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Just came across a similar discussion from February 2010.
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Useful to know that some local people had a positive experience.
Having just carried out further research I think that the reason the door to door marketing is happening is because home energy suppliers have an obligation (so called CERT) to improve the energy efficiency of the homes they supply, but the take up of the scheme is very low because of a combination of suspicion and inertia. I made a mistake earlier in saying this is mostly for low income or people on benefits. These categories will have more help as they are considered a priority, but other subsidies are available for the rest of us. There are also other schemes around, and some local authorities have special deals where they give a discount on council tax if you make efficiency improvements, etc but I don't think this is offered in Haringey.
I suspect home energy suppliers may now be working with other companies to do this door to door marketing in the hope of reaching more people (still not sure - I will check). They have to reach their target (and have just been given a new target starting from March 2011 and until some time in 2012 I think). It costs nothing to the companies as the scheme is then subsidised through everybody's energy bills.
The ultimate aim is to ensure that the UK building stock (among the least energy efficient in Europe...) uses less energy, in order to reach climate change targets and ensure people don't get ill or die of cold in their homes because they can't afford to pay for heating.
My worry is that there may be some con artists out there (although I am still not sure whether we are just dealing with very unprofessional salespeople) and then another worry is that the work done by some small companies may not always be up to high professionally standards as Pamish reported earlier.
But the general problem with low take up may be one of the reasons why the salespeople are being a bit pushy. They are not bothering with sending leaflets because people just don't follow up. At least that's the excuse that the salesperson at my door had for the fact the company is not always sending something in advance (while at the same time looking surprised that this was the case...!)
I am not sure what the solution would be - there are quite a few discussions going on as part of the government's Energy Bill.
In terms of practical advice for anyone whose doorbell rings, it probably goes back to checking the ID, don't let them in just like that, ask for a leaflet and call to arrange an appointment over the phone after having checked the company's website and other credentials (professional memberships, etc), and then perhaps calling your own gas and electricity provider to see if they are able to provide another quote for home insulation. If not, other energy companies may offer you a good deal if you switch to them (e.g. I think British Gas may do this but don't take my word for it). And checking the websites I've pointed to earlier.
And now that I've read my advice above I can really see why take-up is low!
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Permalink Reply by Abi on
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Thanks for doing the research, Germana. I wasn't immediately sure this was a 'scam' when I got a call about this, as the guy seemed legit enough and seemed to know what he was talking about. But the method itself was problematic and I'm sure this will be true for most people.
From reading your observations, what I'm wondering is why don't the energy suppliers just contact existing customers to tell them about this? I'm sure people would trust a company they already have a relationship with a lot more readily than some stranger at the door from an organisation they've never heard of. If it's really that important (and it sounds like it is being done for good reasons!) then I can't begin to understand why they'd go about it in this way.
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Thank you from me too Germana. I did think our loft was sufficiently insulated but I should probably check.
As a matter of principle I never accept cold callers either on the phone or at the door. I don't like being sold to in this manner, I find it far too intrusive and pushy.
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There are a number of issues - it's quite complicated. But generally speaking energy suppliers are interested in supplying electricity and gas and for them energy efficiency improvements to people's homes is not very interesting. They do some of it because they have to by law but generally they like to stick to their core business.
On the other hand there are many smaller companies that have set themselves up to do this and for whom this IS core business. They are also important for the economy as they can create a lot of local jobs. But small companies will have little alternative than to try to reach new customers through telephone, mail and door to door marketing.
There is a list of insulation companies on the National Insulation Association website - they say they cover 90% of the market. This has a member search function which enables you to find an installer in your area or check that someone who visited you is a member.
It also has a code of conduct and it appears that many of the cold callers that have visited us have definitely broken it - in particular they must have identification visible and give you a number to call for more information. They are also supposed to give information in writing before starting any work and give you enough time to change your mind, etc.
Plus insulation has to be carried out to predetermined national standards. So the ones that are acting like "cowboys" and being too pushy and demanding to come into your house immediately, or doing bad quality work are undermining all the others that are doing honest and transparent work.
The website says that if people have concerns about the professional conduct of one of their members they should first complain to the company itself, but the association also has a complaints procedure about members and is also there to help mediate. Of course it's impossible to complain about people who have no ID and I guess these deserve to have the door slammed on their face as of course there is also a possibility they may be con artists.
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