Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!
Illegal job advert?
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Permalink Reply by John D on
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I think you have to be realistic about the language thing. If the job requires you to be fluent in Turkish - as a waiter in a Turkish restaurant for example - a job advert in Turkish will weed out those who would never be given the job and thus save time on both sides.
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It's a question of making the customer feel comfortable, to provide a suitable ambience. I was disappointed to find that the serving staff in a Wightman Rd tapas bar did not speak Spanish. So I won't be back.
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Permalink Reply by Ruth on
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Last time I went to that tapas place John D, nearly two near agot, the staff hardly spoke anything at all they were so reluctant to take orders and engage with clients at all. And even on a 'special' birthday, which they knew, not one bothered to smile let alone offer a happy birthday. They were almost snarling anytime we asked for something like more wine or food
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Permalink Reply by JoeW on
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Quite right too John. I was very disappointed the salesman at the local Renault garage did not greet me with a convivial "bonjour". I have not been back.
:)
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Permalink Reply by Old-Age-Emporium(OAE) on
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John D, did you notice that your withdrawal of custom has led to La Vinya's abrupt demise and change of use? I am considering purchasing the Moka next door to open a French Letters Emporium. I wonder if I can advertise for Assistantes Commerciales with Belles-lettres specialism ?
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Permalink Reply by Betty Careless on
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I've definitely seen jobs in restaurants over here where speaking another language was a required skill (including French). It would be illegal to say only someone Turkish can apply, but its absolutely fine to stipulate that you'll only take on people who speak Turkish if it can legitimately be argued that its a venue where a lot of clients/suppliers etc. speak Turkish and not being able to would mean you can't do the job properly. Lots of adverts stipulate the need to have good written/spoken English for exactly the same reason, and not taking on someone because they don't have the correct language skills is fine. For that reason it's legally fine to have a job advert written in the language you need the applicants to speak. Stipulating you'll only take on women/men in roles where that's not necessary is completely dodgy though - but unfortunately would probably only be policed if someone wanted to sue
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At least there is a translation! At Costcutter Manor House they don't even bother with an English translation.
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Yep, sometimes no translation. Perhaps we should congratulate the place which did bother putting it in English rather than admonish them!
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"only English can apply" is difficult to apply. One cannot be English, one can only assert that you are English. Your nationality is actually British and is the only nationality shown on your passport. Which is why it is impossible to apply for an English passport, there is no such thing.
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Indeed. English is only the language, Britain is the nation. So many foreigners, particularly I find Americans, find that hard to understand. It's the core problem in the UK and has led us into Brexit.
We get confused because in 1966 for the first and only time a country recognised by the UN didn't win the World Cup. England go down on the records, though some of us would say it was West Ham wot really won it.
It's late and I've been in the Salisbury. Good night everybody.
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Permalink Reply by Suraya on
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I was talking to a laywer friend about this the other day. She said job ads are actually a kind of grey area under the law, because the law requires "actual" discrimination rather than "saying" you're going to discriminate - which is all a job ad can do. However, most places that publish job ads (eg, websites) will not allow this kind of thing because it strongly suggests "actual" discrimination will happen in future.
A poster like this would also be golden evidence in a tribunal if any male person who applied for a job wanted to take a case.
Reporting to the police is not the right option - both because "intent to discriminate" isn't a offence and because you need a specific person to be discriminated against - and the right place for them to take it is employment tribunal.
One of the problems preventing this kind of thing is exactly this - there doesn't seem to be any system in the UK to report and have employers who do this advised by someone official, which would be enormously helpful as most seem to do it unaware that it's illegal to discriminate - the Equality and Human Rights commission for example doesn't seem to have a system for people to report these kinds of things; whereas in other countries similar organisations do.
This is by no means a problem restricted to Turkish etc restaurants. If you are a man, try going into the metal/goth bar on Holloway Road called Big Red and ask for a job - they will blatantly tell you that they only employ women to work behind the bar. They say this is because "men are lazy" -_-
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I raised this point before but nobody really dealt with it definitively so here goes again. It's really a question if anybody knows the answer- I don't. Let's suppose a business applies for a Quality Standards mark like Investors In People. Let's further suppose that an audit reveals that too many men and too few women are employed by the business. The business has say three months to rectify this diversity issue to save its application which it has put time and resources into. Is there then a problem for it to advertise for women only (in this case)?
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