Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!
Comprehensive Spending Review - Resident Consultation
Below is a link to the resident consultation for the budget - the more response we get on this the better to get over residents views.
From Cllr Kober
"As we all know the Comprehensive Spending Review will mean we have to consider carefully the services we provide. We are keen that we are well informed about the views of residents and members as we make difficult decisions and agree a very challenging budget.
To help us gather this information we have begun a consultation which will allow residents to tell us what is most important to them. Although many of you will already be involved in the budget setting process, I hope you will all complete the survey and encourage as many residents as you can to do the same."
The survey can be accessed at http://www.haringey.gov.uk/index/council/haveyoursay.htm
Thanks
Cllr Karen Alexander
From Cllr Kober
"As we all know the Comprehensive Spending Review will mean we have to consider carefully the services we provide. We are keen that we are well informed about the views of residents and members as we make difficult decisions and agree a very challenging budget.
To help us gather this information we have begun a consultation which will allow residents to tell us what is most important to them. Although many of you will already be involved in the budget setting process, I hope you will all complete the survey and encourage as many residents as you can to do the same."
The survey can be accessed at http://www.haringey.gov.uk/index/council/haveyoursay.htm
Thanks
Cllr Karen Alexander
Tags for Forum Posts: consultation, public spending cuts
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Hugh on
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I've just completed the survey and I'd strongly encourage you all to do the same.
As a side note - and I don't mean to carp (no really, I don't want to) - I thought it was pretty awful when you compare it with what else is available.
As a user I didn't have the sense that much thought had gone into it so I didn't feel like my views would be really valued + I learned nothing from it.
There are a number of much more user-friendly feedback rich budget consultation tools out there which I'd feel far happier using. Take for instance a Budget Simulator tool published by Delib and used by Northampton Council amongst others.
Alternatively have a look a Redbridge's You Choose set-up.
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Permalink Reply by Old-Age-Emporium(OAE) on
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Me too - and I liked Redbridge's tool, though with a careless mouseclick on one of their sliders I raised their Council Tax by 23%. They didn't like that, suggesting that 5% was my limit.
Now if LBH would allow similar wiggle room (instead of boasting about their Big Freeze) they might be living in the real world between now and 2014/15.
And I'm not convinced that knowing that I'm not a Bisexual Irish Traveller with covert Judaeo-Christian tendencies is going to help them set the Budget needed to see us through the CSR.
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Permalink Reply by Clive Carter on
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OAE, we only have your word for it that you're not a not a Bisexual Irish Traveller with covert Judaeo-Christian tendencies.
On a lighter note, what difference will it make, if I am a Polish Jew, Catholic or Atheist? Either to:
(a) the Comprehensive Spending Review; or knowing
(b) whether or not the council is reaching the parts of Haringey that other surveys cannot reach?
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Permalink Reply by Omotn on
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The only possible response LBH can have to this survey is to ignore it. There is no validation of the respondent's identity - not even a simple check on does he have a valid email address, or a captcha type of mangled character reading to make sure it is actually a person who has answered. Anyone could answer this as often as they wished - I am sure with a keystroke simulator it could be done repeatedly with no real effort. Maybe there is osme check on IP address but using one of the spoofers that enable me to use the iPlayer from abroad even this can be circumvented. Its just so much tosh.
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Permalink Reply by Alison P on
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I must confess that I've started the survey and given up because I'm so unclear as to what I'm being asked.
The questions ask "Which of the following services currently provided are important to you" and then list lots of different services, from child protection to the parks. Now I'm a bit of an anorak about questionnaire wording (it is my job) but this is slack question wording, primarily because the "important to you" bit is ambiguous. Is it asking me which matter to me because I use them, or is it asking me simply which I think are most important? Do you see the difference? Some of my answers depend which approach you take - helping find affordable housing doesn't matter to me at all, in these sense that I don't need it, but I do think it is important for Haringey to do.
Grr. Always worth testing these things first with a few real people.
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Permalink Reply by Alan Stanton on
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Fair points, Alison. I rather think Claire Kober and Lorna Reith (Leader and Deputy Leader) would think so too. Can I suggest you email your comments to them.
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DIVERSITY INFORMATION: Inkjetpack has suggested that this is needed and important, but all this information-gathering has now become an end in itself. A recent topical example suggests that the stated purposes for these exercises are questionable; further, that there is evidence of hypocrisy as well as nonsense.
Apart from the fact that these surveys are largely an exercise in nonsense, you have the basic statistical issues that the online surveys are a self-selected sample, are not-checkable for accuracy of response and according to some suggestions, there is no limit to the number of responses a single individual can make on-line. These survey, alongside which injetpack and some others set such store, may be worse than useless!
Wards Corner: If this kind of information gathering were really so vital, why did Haringey not embark upon it in the case of Wards Corner? That was a case, where, once again, the local council became enmeshed with a property developer and found itself taking short-cuts to further a particular deal.
The development the council was pre-determined upon would have impact on a particular minority ethnic group. If ever there was a real case for gathering such data, this was it. But instead, the council avoided anything that might act as an impediment, which surely questions their commitment to "diversity" in practice.
The Court of Appeal found relatively recently that LBH had failed to discharge their obligations under the Race Relations Act. They had not performed an impact assessment study on the ethnic groups affected.
They had made no effort whatsoever in this direction and their barrister was left to bluster that diversity sensitivity was anyway in every fibre of their being (I paraphrase only slightly). The truth is that when all this diversity stuff threatens to make a unwanted difference, the only attention it gets is lip service!
Haringey's website claims:
"We have a long and successful history of working towards achieving equal opportunity for all our diverse customers and employees. Equalities is a key element of our response to the needs and requirements of all residents, employees and partners."
and they might have added,
... except in cases where it really matters!
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Alison you are right of course. The ambiguity is plain but its a hard job explaining things like that to some council staff because they think they're infallible.
The problem is not just that you and others will hesitate because you don't know what is meant. The problem is also that many people will assume they know what is meant – not detect the ambiguity – and answer accordingly. Who knows what is meant, but some of the assumptions may be wrong.
What does all this mean for the results of such surveys? Not worth a lot, I suggest. In the early days of computing, they used to say GIGO: garbage in [leads to] garbage out
Call me old fashioned, but I think sloppy wording abounds in LBH communications and I fear it sometimes reflects sloppy thinking. I prescribe Remedial English and English Comprehension for offenders!
At the least the survey question below was unambiguous, if a trifle coy. The council (online) survey that I shall treasure always is the one about the future governance regime for the council leader and executive.
95% of the survey was not about the respondent's opinion, but seeking details about the respondent him- or her-self. Of course gender was one of those aspects as was whether your gender differed from you birth sex. If we make a heroic leap and assume this is somehow relevant, I still wonder if anyone affected by this question would wish to divulge this information to the Local Authority – for any reason?
NB: this is not a Photoshop job but an unretouched screen shot (July last year)
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Clive,
The reason they ask for this type of information is that if you provide a public service, want to provide one, or want to change one, you must have evidence that you’ve considered the EHRC, usually by carrying out an Equalities Impact Assessment, see: http://www.equalityhumanrights.com/advice-and-guidance/guidance-for....
The killer thing about this Act is that the person potentially affected only has to BELIEVE they’ve been discriminated against, hence public bodies collating reams of what often appears to be pointless information to mitigate against any potential claim, as there are so many grey areas in this relatively recent legislation as yet untested in court.
It is using this legislation that the Fawcett Society is attempting to obtain a judicial review of the emergency budget carried out earlier this year which disproportionately affected women according to their analysis. Apparently the government did not carry out an assessment and may be in breach, see: http://www.fawcettsociety.org.uk/index.asp?PageID=1177.
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Permalink Reply by John D on
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But surely the best way to avoid accusations of discrimination is not to ask these (and other ) questions. If you answer yes to Q15, you could then complain that your views had been disregarded because (for instance ) they knew that you were incapable of bearing children. The less they know about you the more difficult it would be to discriminate against you.
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Permalink Reply by John McMullan on
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Face to face discrimination covered by the equalities law too?
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