Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!
Petition - Changes to Haringey Waste Services
Hi Everyone [click here for the direct link to the petition].
The recent changes to Haringey's waste service have been well documented on this site in recent days. To recap, these include charging for garden waste collections, replacement bins (unless damaged by Veolia) and bulk collections. If you're familiar with the context, then please feel free to head straight to the petition here. NB... Per Michael's comment please scroll to the end of the next page on the petition site to register your signature.
If not, then read on... Charging for these services isn't uncommon in London - a number of boroughs now do so. However, the basis and evidence case that Haringey Council have used for this is questionable. Papers presented to council members for the Medium Term Financial Strategy (of which this forms part) shows the impact assessment of these changes on residents. There are seven potential negative outcomes on residents identified in Council decision papers as a result of implementing these changes. These are:
- An increase to fly tipping
- Increased use of Recycling and Reuse Centres (one of which I believe is earmarked for closure)
- A decrease in overall resident satisfaction
- An increase in side waste
- Discouraging recycling
- An increase in stolen bins
You can see the assessment here. No single positive outcome to residents was identified. For the council, a positive benefit of £775k in year one, dropping by 30% in year 2 to £525 suggesting the sustainability of these proposals is poor. In order to implement the changes, the Council will be investing at least £150k (IT systems, comms etc). Furthermore, no evidence was presented that a saving will be realised on the Veolia contract due to the reduction in scope.
Given the issues of fly tipping across the borough continue to gather pace, the council have had evidence provided to them that these changes will only serve to increase the problem. Personally, I don't find that acceptable. Things are pretty bad as it stands (example view of a local road today attached). If you agree, please do take a couple of moments to sign the petition by clicking on the link at the top.
Could I close with a small favour to ask? If anyone knows any means to spread this petition to other community sites, blogs etc in Haringey, please do so! Thank you for reading.
Tags for Forum Posts: waste collection charges
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by John McMullan on
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Years ago I owned my own wifi router and it was so powerful you could get a signal in the back yard from the router in the cellar. When the ISPs started giving them away nobody questioned their business model. They give away very weak routers with limited functionality to stop the vomit of information on the internet swamping your home. But I digress, they are to stop you sharing your internet with your neighbour.
Now, is this the impetus we all need to share bins with one another?
I think that they thought as the peasant arm of the Labour Party and that garden waste collection was for land owners who are now "minted", rather than as the Socialist arm who think everyone should have a garden.
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Permalink Reply by Alan Stanton on
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A moment of illumination.
I've just realised that Haringey must have adopted the Quentin Crisp theory of street cleaning.
"I live in one room which has never been cleaned in thirty-five years.
... Never sweep the place where you live because after the first four years the dirt doesn't get any worse.
It's just a question of not losing your nerve." https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mIjuHWUHnhI
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Permalink Reply by Michael Anderson on
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Have you ever seen pictures of Quentin's rooms in Chelsea and New York? Yikes!
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No, I hadn't. But have now looked at part of Dennis Mitchell's 1970 documentary film - also on YouTube.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jnvOegkFi_I
Was that where you had in mind? Or maybe all his rooms were much the same?
The grunge on view seems impossible for someone so exact, so controlled; and personally fastidious. I wondered whether the room with the dirt and gas ring was itself a stage set. A sort of anti-reception room for guests?
I loved his opening comment. (Though from the "Evening" video, I assumed it was a carefully rehearsed line): "This is the window from which on a clear day, you can see normality."
I guess many people know his aphorism about the dirt not getting worse. But I know or remember next to nothing about him. Now even from these minutes listening to and watching him - essentially - perform. Enjoying the jokes and his timing in delivering them, I felt I was somehow hearing or feeling in the background, a silent sadness.
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Permalink Reply by Adrian Hackney on
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The petitin on the LBH website is anonymous. There are no contact details. \What happens to the email addresses of the signatories.
this question has been raised on opinion8
Lyn
I've sent this email to petitions@haringey.gov.uk
Please can you tell me how to find out who initiated a Haringey e-petition? In particular the one on waste services which appears to be anonymous.Please can you also tell me what happens to the details submitted when one signs an e-petition? Are they kept by Haringey? If so how is access to them controlled? Are they shared with the petition organiser?ThanksYou could try that too. An anonymous petition is no use to anyone.
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I think Lyn raises good points which I had not considered before, so I have raised a petition to change the e-petitions system. Should you care to you can read about what I now think are flaws in the Haringey e-petition service. To say almost nothing of the Cabinet's use of the whip to stifle all debate or the fact that a councillor can simply change sides without so much as a nod to the electorate.
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Peter - this is the reply I have had from Haringey. Apparently you do have access to the list of signatories. Could be useful in any follow up.
Dear Mr Essex,
Thank you for your email. My response to your enquiries is as follows:
Our e-petitions are hosted on a portal developed by modern.gov. The details of signatories is held on the portal, and only officers with necessary access and passwords may view this information.
The Lead Petitioner has the option to request that the details of signatories is made public. Unless the list is made public the Lead Petitioner is not able to view it. On this occasion as the Lead Petitioner for this particular petition has not requested to make the list public we do not feel it would be appropriate to share their name and details with you.
I note that you have submitted a request for an e-petition to change the process by which we administrate such e-petitions. We have made the decision to reject this e-petition on the grounds that this is not the correct route for you to raise this issue. It may be helpful for you to note that we would accept a petition that had been hosted on an alterative website, as long as the list of signatories could also be submitted (if necessary in printed form).
Yours sincerely,
Claire Gunn
Feedback Review Officer
Shared Service Centre | Central Team
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Permalink Reply by Katie K on
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We still haven't received any official notification of any of these changes in West Green. Would it be paranoid to think that they are waiting for the petition's expiry date before informing residents in areas of the borough that may be blissfully unaware of the changes?
Cynically yours,
Katie
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Permalink Reply by Hugh on
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I'm not sure what the readership of the Tottenham Indy is, but it would certainly be worth getting the Crouch End edition of the Ham and High to pick this up. Have you tried approaching them?
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Permalink Reply by Protheroe O'Shea on
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I would suggest you pop it over to the Standard too.
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Permalink Reply by Anne Gray on
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This is a recipe for disaster. The council has to spend at least £50 to deal with each incident of fly tipping. Either it won't, or the 'saving' will rapidly be eroded. Solutions? publicise 'freecycle'; free neighbourhod skips for residents once or twice a year; insist that landlords make use of some special collection facility for old mattresses etc. and fine them if they don't (might require registration of landlords in areas with lots of rented buildings, which would probably be helpful for many reasons).
And garden waste? How on earth will we fit 6 wheelie bins (3 per flat) into a forecourt just over 2m. deep? Abandon flowers and shrubs in the garden completely? Give up tending my downstairs neighbours' garden which I have done for years because few short term tenants even cut the grass? There is such limited space for composting in a 30ft by 9ft garden...and bonfires of branches are polluting and possibly dangerous. Why not set up 'bring' sites in parks to which people can bring branches for shredding and soft waste for composting? Both compost and bark chippings are SALEABLE. Dare one suggest that managing such facilities, producing and selling the compost and chippings could even be a social enterprise and a few jobs around the borough?
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