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Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!

New LTN started today. I was working at the beginning of Langham Road, and had a small job on Cornwall Road just off St Anne's. So instead of a two minute drive, I had to drive all the way along West Green Road to Duckett's Common, turn down Green Lanes and thence all the way along St Anne's.There was a long queue of traffic and it took twenty minutes. That's 20 minutes of wasted time, and 20minutes of additional fumes along the route. So the traffic is merely displaced to major roads along with additional pollution for the residents there. Not sure what the benefit is...

Tags for Forum Posts: low traffic neighbourhoods, traffic

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James, the issue for me is who is a rat runner?? 
your neighbours on the next road? 
crouch Enders? ladder folk? Gardens dwellers? 
In the LTN I’ve found myself in, I’ve been classified as a rat runner in my own road! I can’t access the other end and now to get out of my LTN (at particular hours ) I now have to rat run a neighbouring road, a road I never used before.

Ironic really. Still that’s what everyone voted for, apparently. 

Rat runners are those avoiding the main A roads to shave off a few minutes from their journeys thanks to Waze etc. If you had the misfortune of living on one you'd know. Anyone from Crouch End getting in their car to go to Wood Green is exactly the sort of person who hopefully is put off from this foolish idea by the lTNs. Get on a bus or walk - it's easy to do and  - if you go via Ally Pally actually pretty pleasant

No, Andy H, 700 people in St Ann’s voted for the LTN, egged-on by a tiny, unrepresentative pressure group that thinks everyone is able to get on a bike or walk, and just as TfL are planning draconian cuts to bus services across London. 

LTNs are promoted by people who think “their” street should be only for them and that anyone else who has the temerity to drive down it is, by definition, a “rat-runner”, irrespective of where their journey starts or finishes. Some Ladder residents have been complaining for years that the Gardens closure — aka LTN — forced traffic on to their roads, but I’d bet money that when they use their cars (and there are a lot on the Ladder), they think nothing of going down Wightman Road and turning into the side roads off Upper Tollington Park en route to Crouch End or wherever. “Rat-running? Oh, no, it’s just a short cut…..”

It's really, really simple, guys. Burning fossil fuels makes the climate emergency worse. LTNs stop people: local and non-local from using their cars so much, so broadly there is less pollution and less impact on the climate. Our inaction and lethargy have already left it too late to effect a huge amount of environmental damage and our current plans simply aren't good enough to positively impact the environment much at all.

We have to use cars less, that's not really up for much discussion. Future generations are going to view our current society with very little regard and our children and grandchildren's lives and comfort are going to be hugely negatively impacted by the climate emergency, including mass migration as huge parts of the planet become uninhabitable and food supply insecurity grows. If you're not sure what the benefit is, Philip, I suggest you educate yourself a little bit more and look a little wider than Green Lanes, West Green Road and Duckett's Common. 

(Comment edited in line with HoL's House Rules)

it's not that simply and accusing everyone who is against the LTN' does not care is just not helpful. I care very much about the future of my 2 kids and live quite environmentally aware. But it is not proven that LTNs improve air quality - ATM it is much worse in our area and especially in front of our school playground. I'm all up for cycling, public transport etc but it's near impossible to use buses up and down the 2 boundary roads we live in between now. LTNs without access to bus lanes and without improving infrastructure alternative to driving is not the way forward!

Just wait until you personally experience a problem which requires the solution to be a vehicle to get you to some place quickly, whether it be a bus, taxi, hospital transport, a hired car or a lift from a friend. These LTNs should have been introduced gradually, a couple of roads in a block at a time, to allow time for those local residents to alter their habits & try to use their vehicles less as well as allowing better assessment of the impact. It's cheaper to get the companies in to install the blocks, cameras and signage in all at once, but that doesn't serve the most sensible way of trialling a system. As I said above, public transport is already chock full. Buses can't move in the increased traffic. In Tottenham only the 318, W4, & W5 go along any side roads. The short hop fare benefit (take another bus within an hour & it's free of charge) is now eroded as journeys are taking longer crawling along the arterial roads. I don't own a car but do need to occasionally be a passenger in one. I'm against these particular LTNs because of their extreme nature. I'm pro discouraging usage of cars for unnecessary journeys, but with the price of petrol as it is, many people are reducing their driving anyway. But many workers are impacted with the recent resulting congestion.

Before the LTNs were introduced, I used to do a self employed job visiting various specific premises; I got paid per visit + expenses (not very much) so I tried to do them as quickly as possible. The time it took to go by bus and walking severely impacted my average 'hourly' pay. Locally I'd take my bicycle, but was restricted by bad weather, & I constantly got damaged tyres, so the bike was out of action. Further afield shifts I resisted. Not all areas had employees living in them to separate all the work out only locally. Most of my colleagues used their cars and went further afield than me, but with the delays and restrictions now on the roads with more & more LTNs being introduced in the different boroughs, they would be reluctant &/or the job would likely not get done as thoroughly, because all the reasonable time would be taken up with the necessary journeys. 

I feel you but in the not so brave new world your worries are insignificant. I agree totally.

Rory, please moderate your tone.

That's just theory, not reality. Cars are stacking up on mainroutes, with engines running for far longer than they used to. If people walked before, it doesn't affect them. People living on mainroutes now have constant lines of traffic spewing fumes. Public transport is also stuck in traffic making it far less effective. The LTNs don't actually help anyone 

The stopping the emissions argument is void. What we have now is main arterial routes as car parks, stop starting over and over. Those emissions alone are evidence that LTN's are not environmentally friendly. And that's not to mention the impact this increase in stationary traffic is having on emergency services trying to get to 999 calls. Just heard that Downhills Park Road is going to have a LTN on it starting in a week or so. This road is a main artery between WHL & Phillip Lane. Crazy idea.

we should start by being a ULEZ area. We need to stop all the clap trap cars of very old age and bellowing noxious fumes from running. I agree with idea of LTN’s but not if it means people using other main roads creating traffic as this defeats the purpose. Currently LTN’s are just shoving the problem onto other neighbours 

We are in the ULEZ zone.



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