Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by John D on January 23, 2015 at 22:38

Another Council screw - up.

Sorry Chris but it is  

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Permalink Reply by Chris Setz on January 23, 2015 at 23:36

Tell me about it :)

I'm really glad the Council didn't give our largest public space, closed for decades, to a private school for £1/year 'peppercorn' rent!

I blame local people for it being closed for over a decade - local Councillors formed a committee of locals (the Hornsey Town Hall 'Creative Trust') who have presided over it's closure for the last eight years, whilst they meet in secret (observers not allowed, almost all the minutes 'lost'), spent at least £2m of our money planning a 'world class renaissance' that never had a chance of being realised and generally did little else, not sending a single email to their mailing list, never posting here, on Facebook etc.  No doubt they are hard-working dedicated, unpaid local people (mainly two or three individuals) who gained no personal benefit but why didn't the rest of us wrest the project from their cold dead hands?

What did Crouch Enders do? Those who could even be bothered to wonder why this huge blot on our landscape was dark sat back and watched, moaned a bit but waited for the next decision to be dumped on us. Serves us right.

There's an independent Facebook group for those interested in Hornsey Town Hall: https://www.facebook.com/groups/hornseytownhall

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Permalink Reply by Clive Carter on January 24, 2015 at 9:12

I'm really glad the Council didn't give our largest public space, closed for decades, to a private school for £1/year 'peppercorn' rent!

Chris thanks for posting this; I agree with your sentiment and with John's. It seems to me that an opportunity was missed several years ago when a Trust begun by the community was rejected and side-lined by the Council.

It seems to me that, despite rhetoric ("empowerment" etc) to the contrary, the Council prefers to control everything possible, either directly or indirectly. It cannot tolerate large initiatives from the community that tread on its own turf and tend to make it look redundant.

Clive Carter
Haringey Councillor

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Permalink Reply by Chris Setz on January 24, 2015 at 11:40

>>It cannot tolerate large initiatives from the community that tread on its own turf and tend to make it look redundant.

Clive, from your many postings on this site (often highly critical of everything the Council does) I read you as a sophisticated, intelligent articulator of the Lib Dem point of view but this is patent nonsense that seems like crude political point-scoring and bandwagon-jumping to me.

The first contrdictory example that springs to mind is the Crouch End Festival that, like many initiatives here, is independent of outside control - it was the idea of a couple of local people and they just did it, relying on the goodwill, creativity, generosity and determination of a whole group of local people who stepped up to the plate. Nothing to do with the Council, nor the three Lib Dem Councillors who were around when it was launched. The Council seem genuinely keen to celebrate and promote it's success, not to control it. As you clearly have a view on everything that happens here, how informed are you about what goes on I wonder?

It seems to me a conceit of our local politicians that everything that happens in Haringey is of concern and interest to them and they have a view on it and will intervene on behalf of the people if necessary, often by repeating half-truths picked up from others.

This is part of the problem with local politics if you ask me - hubris, an massive over-estimate of the influence you bring to bear.  So much happens here that is completely outside the control of the Council and especially our representatives that they should concentrate on what they can change and have the courage to accept what they can't.

You decided to back a party with so few elected reps as to have no effective power in Haringey whatsoever, didn't you?  Your views and opinions as to how things 'should' be have no chance of seeing the light of day unless they chime with the ruling Labour party, do they?  Your only chance is, by reasoned argument, to help them see an improved path so how do general slurs help anyone?

What I'd like to know is, is it an explicit Lib Dem policy to rubbish the council at every turn?  Is any attention paid to the effect that has?  Surely it must make the Council's job harder or else why would you do it?  Is it in fact your intention to foment dislike of everything the Council does and stands for so they will get voted out? How's that working out for you after what, fifty years of people consistently voting Labour here?

Pretty much none of the people with political power here in our borough get involved on this website, so that leaves the field clear for people like you to lead a charge against them, behind their backs. I guess that you will claim that vigorous opposition is a vital necessity in our democracy but is this what opposition looks like?  Cheap shots?

Lib Dem Cllrs like you were in power in Crouch End through this Hornsey Town Hall debacle - why were they not providing vigorous opposition throughout do you think? What positive ideas and suggestions do you have that could cause you to break the radio silence you arguably ought to maintain? How can you get more people from Muswell Hill supporting efforts to bring Hornsey Town Hall back into sustainable community use? Do you support, for example, the use of the Council Chamber for political debates, the Community Forum etc?

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Permalink Reply by Clive Carter on January 24, 2015 at 18:11

Chris, were you aware of the proposals a few years ago of the Hornsey Town Hall Trust? i.e. not the 'Creative' Trust. If so, what did you think of them?

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Permalink Reply by Chris Setz on January 24, 2015 at 18:23

Keep up, Clive, you've replied to some of my posts on this website about HTH :)

Here's one from four years ago.  As I imagine you did with Ally Pally, I've tried to find out everything I can about HTH in case I can help and took the trouble to verify my impressions with the people most closely concerned with the two Trusts, many of whom were fellow parents at our kid's primary school here in sunny CE.

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