Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!
Haloween and end of Protestanism
On this day 31st October 2017 there is a global ecumenical signing by all major protestant religions and the Roman Catholic church stating that 500 years of protestanism is now at an end.
This has been building behind the scenes for years but today is when churches no longer need to call themselves protestants anymore. What does this mean? Well you need to understand why there was a protest by Martin Luther and many others and why for 1260 years there was papal rule, why the pilgrim fathers fled to America and why the American constitution has an act to separate church and state and why the 45th president is now looking to repeal this, why we have religious liberty today and not one world order religion is because of men like Martin Luther.
So while Haloween is being celebrated the end and start of something serious is happening.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A1euvzA3JDA&feature=youtu.be
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by 1vut8bf3om5m9 on
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Well you need to understand why [....]
No actually you need to understand these things.
I'll start by offering you a £1000 if you can find the words "separation of church and state" in the US Constitution. Hint - look in the 1st Amendment as a starting point.
Second, I'll be glad to see some sound evidence of how the 45th President is now looking to repeal something that the US Constitution doesn't even say.
Third just my own musing--why is it that liberals are so vehement when it comes to a civil right like freedom from an established religion (which is what the 1st Amendment actually says) but not the civil right to defend oneself in the very same American constitution? (See the 2nd Amendment.)
Finally, the fact that you would call Puritans who were basically thrown out of this country "Pilgrim fathers" means a cut and paste job of someone else's description, and that someone else is writing from the American perspective.
Look I am all for a discussion on historical antecedents, but they have to be reasonably factual as a starting point.
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Permalink Reply by John D on
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Those words do not appear verbatim but " Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; " pretty much covers it.
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Permalink Reply by Ian on
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It was no cut and paste but I choose to use the word pilgrim as it does reflect the words that they used to describe themselves at the time. The so called puritans were actually persecuted by the British church so fled to find freedom of worship, so they were not thrown out against their will but fled.
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evidence from Trumps direct words that are underpinned by evangelicals and protestants within the trump camp that are calling for America to get back to God to heal the nation and solve climate change.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/sharia-law-may-be-coming-to...
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Permalink Reply by Martin (Woodside) on
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Brought up as C-of-E, I'd never heard of the term Protestant until the Irish Troubles began, it's true title from what I have been told is Anglo-Catholic. It may beg the question of a generic description of the lesser churches eg. Baptist, Methodist, Presbytarian etc, 'Lutherian' would cover them amicaby.
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Permalink Reply by John McMullan on
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lesser... ha ha ha... good one.
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@ Martin. I disagree. The Church of England is a body that ranges from High to Low in its observances. An Anglo-Catholic church will have services very close to those of the Roman Catholic church, with bells, crossing, genuflecting and incense and will give special emphasis to the Virgin Mary. The services in a Low C of E church will be simpler with less formal ritual. But both are C of E.
I would say that any Christian church that is not Roman Catholic is Protestant. The Church of Scotland is a Protestant Presbyterian church distinguished by the fact that each congregation enjoys a great deal of democratic autonomy and that there is no ecclesiastical hierarchy ( bishops etc ). I'm not sure that the Presbyterians would take kindly to being called Lutherans.
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Permalink Reply by Michael Anderson on
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Thank God I’m an athiest
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Permalink Reply by Tom Devine on
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Who can’t spell
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Where is separation of church and state?The phrase "separation of church and state" itself does not appear in the United States Constitution. The First Amendment states that "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof."This expression was however put into the constitution for the direct reason to separate church and state.
Jefferson and the Bill of Rights[edit]
Main articles: Establishment Clause and Free Exercise Clause
Thomas Jefferson, the third President of the United States, whose letter to the Danbury Baptists Association is often quoted in debates regarding the separation of church and state.
In English, the exact term is an offshoot of the phrase, "wall of separation between church and state", as written in Thomas Jefferson's letter to the Danbury Baptist Association in 1802. In that letter, referencing the First Amendment to the United States Constitution, Jefferson writes:
Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between Man & his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, & not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should 'make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof,' thus building a wall of separation between Church and State.[25]Jefferson was describing to the Baptists that the United States Bill of Rights prevents the establishment of a national church, and in so doing they did not have to fear government interference in their right to expressions of religious conscience. The Bill of Rights was one of the earliest examples in the world of complete religious freedom (adopted in 1791, only preceded by the Declaration of the Rights of Man and of the Citizen in 1789).[original research?][citation needed]
Later Interpretations[edit]
John F. Kennedy, one of America's most influential presidents of the 20th century[citation needed], commented in 1960:
I believe in an America where the separation of church and state is absolute, where no Catholic prelate would tell the President (should he be Catholic) how to act, and no Protestant minister would tell his parishioners for whom to vote, where no church or church school is granted any public funds or political preference – and where no man is denied public office merely because his religion differs from the President who might appoint him or the people who might elect him.I believe in an America that is officially neither Catholic, Protestant nor Jewish – where no public official either requests or accepts instructions on public policy from the Pope, the National Council of Churches or any other ecclesiastical source – where no religious body seeks to impose its will directly or indirectly upon the general populace or the public acts of its officials – and where religious liberty is so indivisible that an act against one church is treated as an act against all.
— John F. Kennedy
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