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Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!

Guys hanging out at Turnpike Lane Station

Anyone recognise the group of young guys who always seem to be hanging outside the betting shop by the Tesco at Turnpike Lane Station? Are they the same group who were ASBOed off Duckett's Common? I've seen the same guys just hanging there about half a dozen times over the last few weeks. Definitely not there to have a flutter on the GGs...

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Permalink Reply by Cat on March 21, 2014 at 9:41

We still give patients heroin - it's called diamorphine.

Permalink Reply by Angela on March 17, 2014 at 19:30

Blimey, 2 + 2 really does equal 5.

Girl? Posh? Marijuana?

Permalink Reply by Pete on March 25, 2014 at 11:11

As someone who lives very close to the tube station and the common I'm often hassled by this group of people with "You want to buy something?" when pushing my 2 year old son along in his buggy. They find this hilarious and sometimes try to block our path as we worriedly try to hurry past. I'm quite disturbed that there's people on here who seem to find this funny and nothing to get upset about.

I recently saw this same group blocking the path and hassling a terrified and bewildered elderly man who must have been in his 80s outside Tescos - "Yes old man, you looking to buy something ? You want to get high ? HA HA HA HA !!!!"

I just can't understand that there's people on here who find this perfectly acceptable. These aren't kids either, they're young men, and to say these 10 or so people have no choice, or that it's right wing to not appreciate this group hassling people pushing children in buggies and 80 year old men is ridiculous.

Permalink Reply by Pete on March 25, 2014 at 14:33

They certainly enjoy terrifying people that's for sure, the old man they were hassling was clearly terrified and they found this hilarious, it was heartbreaking to watch and I wish I had the bottle to stand up to them but I'm ashamed to say I was too scared, especially as I have to walk past them with my son every day.

Permalink Reply by Cat on March 25, 2014 at 14:37

If they are proving themselves to be consistently intimidating and antisocial, why not report the group on 101?

Permalink Reply by Cat on March 25, 2014 at 15:19

What? I have absolutely no idea how you inferred that from what I said. Of course I'm not blaming him, I am suggesting he contact the police about it. 'Prove' in this context (in case English isn't your first language) is the same as saying 'shown' or 'demonstrated' - nothing whatsoever to do with some weird notion about a burden of proof.

And no, we can't just assume a constant police awareness and presence. That's why people have to report things.

Permalink Reply by HarringayBirder on March 25, 2014 at 14:39

That is a very nasty ordeal to have to go through. Have you complained to the police? This is clear anti-social behaviour if not harassment and there is absolutely no reason whatsoever why you should have to tolerate it or why the police would be justified in not investigating and then acting. It may be you would need to give evidence (although there is CCTV at that junction which would no doubt show what had gone on). If however you were required to give evidence then you would have the right to ask for screens to protect your identity. Please don't feel intimidated into not making a complaint.

Permalink Reply by Pete on March 25, 2014 at 16:10

Hi, yes, I've complained to the police many times, and of late have had some encouraging talks with Inspector Craig Middleton who seems serious about trying to do something about them. I understand that the main problem for the police is actually catching them in the act of selling drugs as apparently they stash them elsewhere. The situation did improve when many of the group were arrested last year and found guilty of a variety of offences and some did receive prison sentences and ASBO's banning them from the area but unfortunately as we can all see they're back again now.

You do often see them passing packets backwards and forwards between each other so yes, if you do see this please do call 101. I know a lot of women are also being harassed by them so please do report them if it happens to you.

Permalink Reply by HarringayBirder on March 25, 2014 at 17:55

Hi Pete

You said

"the main problem for the police is actually catching them in the act of selling drugs"...

I wasn't talking about that - I was talking about these people acting in a harassing and intimidating manner towards you and your son. The police do not need any proof of any connection at all with drugs to take action about that behaviour. It amounts clearly to anti-social behaviour and the police, provided they can identify any of the individuals responsible, can obtain orders banning those persons from so acting, hanging around in that location etc.

Furthermore:

"Where a Police Superintendent or above has reasonable grounds for believing that members of the public have been intimidated, harassed, alarmed or distressed in public places in a specific area (referred to as the relevant locality) and that anti-social behaviour is significant and a persistent problem in that area, he may make a written authority under s 30 ASBA with the consent of the Local Authority allowing Police Officers and Police Community Support Officers to disperse groups of more than two people."
 
The police have plenty of tools at their disposal; I wonder if they simply need to be persuaded to use them?
Permalink Reply by HarringayBirder on March 25, 2014 at 17:57

"The situation did improve when many of the group were arrested last year and found guilty of a variety of offences and some did receive prison sentences and ASBO's banning them from the area but unfortunately as we can all see they're back again now."

That cannot be correct: ASBOs last for a minimum of two years. It sounds as if the people prosecuted may simply have had bail conditions attached. The police or the CPS can supply you with the information you need; I would start with your Inspector. Note what he says.

Permalink Reply by Pete on March 25, 2014 at 18:23

Hi, thanks for replying, very interesting and helpful - you're quite right about the ASBO thing, I've just gone back and re-read the e mails I've received and I'm getting ASBO's mixed up with Dispersal Orders - this is from an e mail I received from Mike Bagnall a few weeks ago, Haringey Council's Anti Social Behaviour manager....

'The previous Dispersal Order expired on the 25th January 2014. It was not automatically extended due to previous communication received from residents that there were still ongoing problems at the Common despite the Dispersal Order being in place.  Since that time, the Council and the Police have been reviewing how any further extension can support other enforcement initiates as well as the resources available. It  was considered inappropriate to  renew the Dispersal Order without carrying out this  review , which is being chaired by Inspector Craig Middleton.
 
There have been previous arrests carried out by the Police and action taken by the Council against known perpetrators but as I mentioned in my last email to you, even with a Dispersal Order in place, the Police cannot be at the Common 24  hours a day; as a result, there may be a risk that dealing will take place when they are not in attendance. During these times it is important that the Public make reports to the Police should they witness such activity or be approached . I am unsure if you made a report to the Police at the time you were approached but it would be helpful if you do so in the future by calling 101.'

But what you're saying about harassment and intimidation is very interesting as I just presumed there was nothing that could be done about this, and for me this is the worst thing about this group being there - not just for mine and my son's sake but as I say when I see them targeting old people and women who are quite clearly terrified it really makes my blood boil, and the fact that something could be done about this makes me even more angry ! 

Permalink Reply by Cat on March 25, 2014 at 18:25

You should absolutely report them or their antisocial behaviour. Describe the experiences you have had, as well as what you have seen.

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