Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!
Fly tippers taking the mick....
Hi all,
Found those dumped clothes yday on Warham Road. Fly tippers really taking the mick here given that the warning sign is right above the pile. I think this picture exemplifies the council's failed policies and measures in dealing with this ongoing problem. I feel like things have gotten worse again in the last few weeks with more dumped rubbish on our streets. We made a push few months ago trying to address the problem. Maybe worth re-engaging with the council.
I hate having to walk along our streets and explaining to our children why there is so much rubbish on our streets.
Time for the council to act and step up their game.
Dominik
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Robert Pike on
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Take our Rubbish Survey: https://www.surveymonkey.co.uk/r/DXG2VPK
The photo is the kind of thing Tidy Up Tottenham were founded to fight. We're an independent community group and you can find out more here: https://www.tidyuptottenham.org/
Our survey is gathering data that we can use to challenge the councils own strategies, which I assume many believe are ineffective at tackling local "tossers".
And if your kids are affected we are starting our school outreach programme in September. Because kids seem to understand way more than some adults.
W
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Permalink Reply by Dan on
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It's nice that the council have recognised the problem.
but...
What on earth will an education campaign measurably set out to achieve? I'm really tired of this lack of evidence-based policy making. A poster is not going to stop littering.
Bigger fines, sure - why not?
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One suggestion: Increase the council tax for repeat offenders, no avoiding paying fines that way.
My feeling, and from experience approaching fly tippers caught in the act, is that:
a) They just don't care, they see other people doing it and so follow those actions knowing that it'll get picked up at some point, or
b) There is a clear language barrier in some cases, which might effect some residents' or businesses' understanding of refuse collections (what to recycle, etc), council policy and/or generally different attitudes to how people should and want to live in the borough. Putting up signs on lamp posts, as exampled in the original post, are largely ineffective based on the evidence in that photo!
My last encounter with fly tippers was resulted in the threat of physical violence towards me so I'm more cautious and reserved on the idea of residents taking action into their own hands, however, there has to be a way residents who care can work with the council on a large, hard-hitting scale, along with groups such as the Tidy Up Tottenham campaign, in order to target offenders quickly and effectively?
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Permalink Reply by Bob Ruggles on
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I added a link what Haringey are currently doing. as posted daily on their Facebook Page
Joke was last week a combine operation of 20 plus and Only 6 people issued Notices
Environment Protection Act was brought in because Local Authorities like Haringey and others was Not Enforcing BY- Laws
But its Down to Haringey Rate Payers to put pressure on Our Elected Councillors
Especially after checking how much they get in Standing Fees and Expenses
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I don't think leveraging fines against taxes is possible.
My thoughts is the council should push this out as a conditionally-funded tech competition for startups to solve the problem. Using the education budget, which IMO is a waste of money. There is no evidence to support this as a good spend. SBRI is a great start.
IMHO there are three issues:
1) Prevention. Increasing fines for sure, and understanding and communicating perpetrators.Why is this happening? What are the economics from a fly tipper's perspective? A lot of collaborative thinking needed here, as every council in the UK is dealing with this, in their own way, I imagine.
I completely agree with JoLu on this.
2) Detection. Means of identifying perpetrators using CCTV, machine learning/recognition/regressions/predictive analytics
3) Clear up. Increasing incentives for reporting and clear up (without creating 'gaming' opps) - which remove the problem quickly in an efficient way. There are some really smart ways this can be incentivised, without going down traditional 'rely on someone caring the right way' or 'vouchers'.
But I expect LBH to spend a ton of cash on a rubbish (pardon the pun) campaign, which is solely about showing they are doing something. Go PR!
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Permalink Reply by Michael Anderson on
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In addition to the ideas others have mentioned, a few things come to mind on how this can start to be addressed
- Haringey already have a big street presence - the civil enforcement officers who deal with parking. Would it be worth renegotiating the contract when it comes up to give them a reporting role. Arm them with mobiles or other devices that give them direct access to the systems they need for reporting. They already carry cameras so these can be used to record actual incidents as the occur.
- Bring back community clear out days. These were hugely successful when they were held. A couple of time a year a street is encouraged to put out bulk waste the night before and a truck comes up the road the next morning to clear it all away.
- Volunteer Street wardens. Locals who can make the commitment to keep an eye on dumping in their immediate area.
- Make better use of data. Haringey have terra bites of data from idiots like me who log reports. A commercial company would pay a fortune for intelligence like this and they are getting it for free. Really squeeze every drop of out in. Identify the hot spots and repeat addresses and do something about them.
I’m sure people have loads of other ideas.
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Some great ideas (and Dan). How do we get these to someone who can do something? Presumably contact Seema Chandwani again (the post suggests she is open to further dialogue)..?
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Permalink Reply by Katie K on
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I've just tweeted a link to this thread to her @Cllrseema. She does usually respond.
Katie
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Don’t suppose anyone fancies collating all the ideas so and maybe categorising them?
Maybe Seema herself can then respond in due course - she is good with correspondence I find!
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This thread from July 2017 nicely sums up the issues (from page 4 onward). It was sent with a covering email to the then lead member for environment and not even an acknowledgement was received, never mind a response
https://www.harringayonline.com/forum/topics/a-rubbish-day-in-harri...
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