Harringay online

Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!

So I can hear many people being pleased about this, but I can promise you fining people for jumping red lights doesnt work

its the 2nd time I have been fined and this time it cost me £50 on a very rainy monday by a very grumpy young PC- not happy- all cars staitonary- and no pedestrians

But will it stop me ( or other serial red light jumpers like me)- well its a BIG FAT NO-

Its just now I will have to make sure there are no police cars in the vicinity- So infact instead of making the roads safer, instead of me previously doing a thorough check of the road of any cars, pedestrians, other cyclists., I now have to check for police which means Im possibly less than 100% focused on everything else

So to put this in context

I am a middle age woman who has been cycling  in london on a daily basis for the last 30years. I have been knocked off quite a few times( absolutely none of them my fault)

 2 of my accidents in my early years of cycling where  when i was leaving traffic lights- so I learnt like many other cyclists, traffic lights are dangerous places to stop- So provided its totally clear, get on your way. The more cyclists on the road, the worst junctions seem with the cluster of cyclists trying to find room with cars behind getting impatient and trying to squeeze through dangerously narrow gaps

So you are never going to convince me or many other cyclists its safer to stop at red lights- although i might be a bit richer

So any PC PlODS out there dont waste your time especially on a rainy day - go and catch real crims

So i know many wont agree wth this, but unfortunately a few cyclists give us all a bad name- such as cyclists

who jump lights in a dangerous way( when there are cars around

cyclists who go on pavments and weave around pedestians- scarring them

cyclists who dont stop at pedestrian crossings when people are crossing-terrible!!!!!!!!!!

But something needs to be done with all these recent deaths, and I would be really interested in what the circumstances were- i would guarantee it wasnt due to jumping a light-unless of course the person had been drinking etc

Most bad accidents/fatalities happen by people obeying the law- so the law needs to be changed

And when are pedestrians going to be fined for jay walking across roads and knocking cyclists off

I got sent flying only 2 months ago by a pedestrian running out in front of me on green lanes, close to the ale emporium- the 3rd time a  pedestrian has knocked me off over the years

Right Rant finished

And anyone/cyclist wants to make our roads safer, see the petition below

http://you.38degrees.org.uk/petitions/save-our-cyclists

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Oh and i forgot to add I think there should be compulsory training for cyclists as well as training for car drivers lorries

so many cyclists still go up the inside of trucks about to turn

City police did a great initiative a few years ago, where they stopped all cyclists going through red lights and made them sit up in HVG lorry so the could get an idea how limited the view for drivers was

You have my sympathy tigha. I remember reading somewhere about the police doing a blitz in Harringay on cyclists going through red lights, it seemed so daft to me with all the bigger problems we have. I mean, the number of times i see people driving down Frobisher and Falkland Rds, past a primary school, while on their cell phone, but instead they're wasting time on this, which as you say is safer for the cyclists to get out of they way.

PM me and i'll give you £5 towards the fine, hopefully a few others can offer to do the same too.

Yes, the Police do have better things to do and perhaps they could get on with them if they didn't have to waste their time dealing with idiots who think they can decide when and when not to obey the rules of the road.

I am not going to disagree with anything you have said about safety etc. I'll just tell you why I DO stop at red lights (no, not just because it's the law): it is because in this country pedestrians have first right on the road. They are the ones allowed to cross without traffic lights and that means that cyclists can't.

Last year I watched a PC on a bicycle on Bishopsgate crash into a pedestrian (both female) who was crossing against the red light. All they could do was pick themselves up and continue on.

This post is actually very relevant to Harringay because it was outside the Salisbury Hotel that Britain's first ever pedestrian traffic light was installed and a temporary law banning pedestrians from the road unless the light was green. The law lapsed and now pedestrians, defacto, have the first right on the road.

I think it is incredibly subversive of Ant to offer to contribute towards your fine so I will too £5.

I don't jump lights (or ride through zebra & pelican crossings) on my daily commute cycling as I adhere to the law. I have never had one issue with waiting at the lights, not one. I have never had an incident or being knocked off as I command my space on the road. I have been riding in London for about twelve years.

The other week I was the only one of a pack of about ten cyclists who didn't get fined at a pedestrian crossing near the Sobell.
I am sorry I have no sympathy and it's about time responsible cyclists took back the moral high ground. You cannot comment on other road users and their aggressive behaviour and act the same way. I agree with making cycling safer and investing heavily in cycle routes, education and safety. Sorry, it's a absolute pet hate of mine.

This is not a sectarian, them and us argument. Queue predictable abuse.

It's worth noting that I (& my children) have almost been hit by cyclists going through red lights (at high speed) on the pedestrian crossings on green lanes (in the inside of stopped cars). This really is very dangerous.
[I usually try to make it look like I'm about to step in front of them, or sticking my arm out, which makes them notice me - this also works for cars on zebra crossings!]
It's hard enough to cross green lanes with children at the best of times, and it would be good if we could rely on the green man.
Note that I'm a cyclist.

I have to stop at the lights to allow time for the red mist to clear.

In April of this year, I started cycling again regularly for the first time in about 30 years.  Since then, I have commuted on a daily basis from Green Lanes to my workplaces in Clerkenwell, Kings Cross and Archway.

I decided right from the word go that I would obey the HIghway Code to the letter as best I could. I also had a few lessons in how to rise assertively and how to 'own' your space, including the cyclists boxes at junctions.  I find that because of that, I have had no trouble to speak of from car drivers. In fact, I find them on the whole extremely considerate and that includes taxi drivers, who are notorious for hating cyclists. And like I did when I used to own my very fast cars, I think two or three moves ahead, meaning I would never for example, ride up the inside of a lorry or bus.

I firmly believe that if I am to have an accident, that it is far more likely to be at the hands of another cyclist - and my experience thus far that theory has been confirmed. The latest example was this evening, when coming down Drayton Park. I'd anticipated that the car in front was turning right and positioned myself to go round it. But then, out of nowhere a cyclist appears swerving into an impossible gap between the two of us and almost forcing me off course.

I am utterly amazed at how many cyclists seem to think traffic laws don't apply to them. The other day a mate of mine who is an ambulance driver was called to a collision between two cyclists who'd both jumped the lights and while he treated them, they continued to argue about who had the right of way, even though they'd both acted illegally. And thats so typical of those kind of cyclists. Try remonstrating with them and they become instantly aggressive.

I hope the police keep fining cyclists and also that they crack down on repeat offenders. Mind, I also welcome the recent initiative where police were also fining drivers who encroached cycle boxes too and I wish they would do more of that. But to those cyclists who still insist on jumping red lights, I say as I always say when they do it 'don't complain when you die'.

Hey Veggie Reggie, is that the purple beast I pulled out from the undergrowth in my back yard, or did it turn out to be not worth repairing?  Pam.

You've proved from your post that you know the law. You go through a red light you're breaking the law. You get caught you pay the fine. Stop moaning.

Ah, Matt beat me to it - get over yourself!

Unfortunately the cyclists who give the rest a bad name are the ones who conspicuously flout the law to their own advantage. Despite your assertions that you can do this without endangering yourself (I agree that jumping red lights isn't necessarily dangerous) or anyone else, you're quite clearly one of them.

Pedestrians can't be fined for 'jaywalking' because there is no such offence in the UK. Like John says, they should be given the most respect of anyone using the road, and while I agree that some accidents are unavoidable, the fact is that many cyclists are nowhere near cautious enough in situations where pedestrians may suddenly appear. Green Lanes is a perfect example of this, where people cross the road between stationary traffic.

It's also worth mentioning that the 'strict liability' laws which apply in almost all of the rest of Europe and have been discussed here. While they would make it easier for cyclists to make claims for damages against motorists, the flip side is that any cyclist hitting a pedestrian would leave them open to a civil claim unless they could prove that the accident wasn't their fault. It'd be very welcome from my point of view.

To be honest it sounds like your otherwise a responsible and aware cyclist, I'd just urge you show a little more patience and resist sneaking through lights for no real advantage. Without wanting to come across as condescending, if you find dealing with queues of traffic dangerous (it really needn't be) then free cycle training is available from the council, check the website.

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