Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!
bet365 & Labour
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Chris Setz on
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Are you accusing someone (even by sly implication) of wrongdoing Clive?
There are so many nasty stories written at the behest of our billionaire-dominated right-wing press that I am sure ones blaming a wide range on non-Tories for a wide range of things can easily be found. Who else, though, apart from you, has the time to promote them to HoL readers to help the all-but-sunk Haringey Lib Dems make political capital?
As you have absolutely no chance of making any difference at all to the betting situation, why not spend time helping improve the things you can actually improve? If you were to do that, what could you actually improve? Is there anything you have already improved since election?
Reading some of the other posts you've made on HoL, you appear to be an intelligent person who pays attention to detail. Why not use more of those undoubted skills in more specifically helpful ways than this politically-motivated bleat? Or is it that you can't find anything better to do at 11pm on a Wednesday evening?
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Permalink Reply by John McMullan on
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"Or is it that you can't find anything better to do at 11pm on a Wednesday evening?" <- that's a bit mean. I take it he struck a raw nerve.
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Don't intend to be mean John.
I have gained the impression, and one or two people have confirmed, that Clive is a well-respected local person. He finally stepped into the ring by having the courage to stand for election as a local Councillor in a distant ward and, kudos, got elected!
He has, however, no political 'power'. The Lib-Dems are down to a very few councillors in Haringey, just as they are down to a very few MPs in Westminster. There is practically nothing 'Lib Dem' he can achieve in a Borough that has voted Labour for the last 50 years of elections. Let's face it, Haringey has never wanted his sort of politics.
So, if you were him, what would you do?
For instance, Highgate seems under attack by very rich people who are the only ones who can afford the millions it costs to live in the many huge properties in Highgate. That "1%" (who are known to avoid all but 1% of their tax liability) want to abuse some of our beautiful local green spaces and lovely houses in N6. This issue has gained widespread, determined opposition and brilliant groups of locals have banded together to defeat the largely non-dom wealthy with their basement-hungry fortunes.
I don't think Clive lives in Highgate and groups like the Highgate Neighbourhood Forum and the Highgate Society were established long before he arrived on the scene, but having met some of them they do seem open and friendly so would probably welcome his active participation. Their work is so important to the future of the ward that if it were me, I'd want to be closely involved where I could help. Maybe it's too difficult for a Lib-Dem Cllrs to add any value?
As another example, there's a housing estate in Highgate battling with the Council who want to use some of the land to build more houses and the estate tenants don't want that. Could Clive maybe help there?
I frankly think Clive's constant Council-bashing and rumour-spreading approach in his many posts on this site must be taking up a huge amount of his time and that's a shame. We need Councillors to show the way forward and he seems to be ducking that responsibility. We're in dire need of representation and fewer and fewer of us can even be bothered to vote. Our democracy is dying. The last thing we need is what appears to be a local councillor venting his obvious frustration that he has no effective political power - we need our Cllrs working for us, not against us.
So, rather than reinforce a contentious old story about unintended consequences a decade ago, I want him to be much more 'on the money' and address the many and urgent issues his own ward looks to their local councillor for. His recent post resurrected a two-year old topic about much older events and bunged in a slur against an MP. Could all this simply be a displacement activity?
Out of respect for his potential prowess, I am urging him to stop bashing others. Focus on those things he can change, and have the courage to accept those he can not.
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Thanks Billy. What seems to be happening is that as politicians abuse their power, so it is taken away from them. As they cannot get more than 50% of us to turn out, does that not mean that politics has failed?
I think it's a hoary old myth that Cllrs can be the voice of the voter - they're clearly not. They just seem like cuts administrators to me. What we should do is to go for direct democratic control. Why can't we vote on most things instead of our Cllrs doing it for us? If the Labour Party can elect their leader online, why can't we decide on policy online? Cut out the middleman :)
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In an ideal world yes, but the reality is surely that Cllrs are whipped. They follow the party line. They are not able to dream up policies and then enact them - they do what they are told. They are appointed to various cttees and can be removed. So, even if a bunch of Cllrs in the ruling party are opposed to something, it'll still get done in spite of them, just like at Westminster.
Ever seen a 'debate' at the Council? No, I thought not - they only happen behind closed doors and if you disagree with the leader, tough.
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Permalink Reply by Clive Carter on
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Hi John. Evidently I can't find anything better to do at 11pm on a Wednesday evening. Equally evidently, neither can Mr Setz!
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The difference is, I enjoy the odd post, you're paid by us to do it (you gain a salary as a Cllr) - I want better value for my money from you, whereas all you can expect from me is fun ;)
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Permalink Reply by Alan Stanton on
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Thanks for that link, Clive. As we all know, you have to scrub your hands after touching a copy of the Daily Mail - and disinfect your hard drive if you view the online version.
But I am surprised and would be disappointed if the allegation made about Tristram Hunt is accurate.
I don't think the issue of party donations or MPs' funding can or should be ignored. None of the three main parties are innocent on this. Ten years ago the "Cash for Honours" allegations were in the press. Last year we saw a research paper reported.
And if anyone wants to Google the topic the difficulty is too many rather than too few separate sets of allegations.
A rich man or woman riding a camel may have a problem getting through the eye of needle. It seems they'd have far less of a hassle if they asked their chauffeur to drive a stretch limo into the car park of a Party HQ.
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Alan the truth can emerge in surprising places!
Two years ago over someone's shoulder I read a headline about Haringey Council representatives—including a Labour Councillor—going to Cannes to meet property developers to promote a Tottenham sell-off.
At first I was disinclined to believe it, simply because who said it, rather than what they said.
Later, it turned out to be largely true, despite the fact it appeared in the Communist Morning Star.
Like the Daily Mail, it's not my normal paper.
Representatives from Haringey are going again to Cannes in March, as I'm sure you know.
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Clive, as you know well, though we don't always agree, I consider what you and others have to say when the comments are well informed and on substantive points. Quite plainly gambling generally and Fixed Odds Betting terminals is a case in point. So is the issue of possible conflicts of political patronage and cash for influence and honours.
Can I suggest though, that you add further comments about the Bull/Peacock victimisation scandal on that discussion. Especially as it now seems to have gone viral. I'm told - but haven't yet been able to find it online - that there's now a petition with signatures from other countries.
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