Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!
Any Harringay nominations for Haringey's 'locally listed' buildings list?
There are currently 1647 listed buildings in Haringey. These fall into two categories:
a) haringey_statutory_listed_buildings_-_alphabetical.pdfthose listed by English Heritage (graded Grade 1, Grade 2* and Grade 2). These are known as "nationally listed". We have 470 of these in the borough
b) register_of_local_listed_buildings_of_merit.pdfthose that are listed by the Council as being "buildings of merit". These are known as "locally listed". There are 1,177 in this category
The Council's Conservation Department has recently compiled Alterations to Local List1[1].doca list of proposed additions to the local list. Some of these buildings have been included following recommendations made by local individuals or groups. At a rough count there are a further 700 buildings on the list.
For all counts, groups of buildings (like a short terrace) are counted as a single building.
If these lists were to be split evenly between all Haringey's 18 wards you'd expect the following numbers of buildings per ward for each list:
Statutory list: 26
Existing local list: 65
Proposed additions to local list: 39
Harringay is roughly a ward and a half so the numbers you'd expect here are:
Statutory list: 39
Existing local list: 97
Proposed additions to local list: 58
And how many does Harringay actually have?
Statutory list: 2 (The Salisbury & St John's Greek Orthodox Church on Wightman)
Existing local list: 5 (The Beaconsfield pub, former fire station on Conway Rd, New River Aqueducts at Eade, Seymour & Wightman Rds)
Proposed additions to local list: 4 (13-22 Grand Parade, 1-25 Hermitage Rd, St Paul's Church, Wightman Rd, stench pipe on Umfreville Rd)
(Depending on where your personal Harringay borders are, the new list also proposes the inclusion of Woodlands Junior, Chestnuts and a number of buildings in St. Ann's Hospital.)
I know that it's unrealistic to expect an even distribution of buildings of interest in any borough. And I know some of the best have been demolished already, but is the rest so undeserving of merit?
There is still time to propose additions to the local list. You can either write or use the from Haringey Council have designed for the purpose.
Contact details for Design and Conservation Team
Design and Conservation Team
Planning Policy and Transportation Group
Urban Environment
639 High Road
Tottenham
N17 8BD
Tel 020 8489 1479
Fax 020 8489 5552
I'm afraid I don't have an email address to hand. If someone gets it, please can they come back and post it.
I've asked our councillors if they will support our area and stand up for Harringay's buildings.
a) haringey_statutory_listed_buildings_-_alphabetical.pdfthose listed by English Heritage (graded Grade 1, Grade 2* and Grade 2). These are known as "nationally listed". We have 470 of these in the borough
b) register_of_local_listed_buildings_of_merit.pdfthose that are listed by the Council as being "buildings of merit". These are known as "locally listed". There are 1,177 in this category
The Council's Conservation Department has recently compiled Alterations to Local List1[1].doca list of proposed additions to the local list. Some of these buildings have been included following recommendations made by local individuals or groups. At a rough count there are a further 700 buildings on the list.
For all counts, groups of buildings (like a short terrace) are counted as a single building.
If these lists were to be split evenly between all Haringey's 18 wards you'd expect the following numbers of buildings per ward for each list:
Statutory list: 26
Existing local list: 65
Proposed additions to local list: 39
Harringay is roughly a ward and a half so the numbers you'd expect here are:
Statutory list: 39
Existing local list: 97
Proposed additions to local list: 58
And how many does Harringay actually have?
Statutory list: 2 (The Salisbury & St John's Greek Orthodox Church on Wightman)
Existing local list: 5 (The Beaconsfield pub, former fire station on Conway Rd, New River Aqueducts at Eade, Seymour & Wightman Rds)
Proposed additions to local list: 4 (13-22 Grand Parade, 1-25 Hermitage Rd, St Paul's Church, Wightman Rd, stench pipe on Umfreville Rd)
(Depending on where your personal Harringay borders are, the new list also proposes the inclusion of Woodlands Junior, Chestnuts and a number of buildings in St. Ann's Hospital.)
I know that it's unrealistic to expect an even distribution of buildings of interest in any borough. And I know some of the best have been demolished already, but is the rest so undeserving of merit?
There is still time to propose additions to the local list. You can either write or use the from Haringey Council have designed for the purpose.
Contact details for Design and Conservation Team
Design and Conservation Team
Planning Policy and Transportation Group
Urban Environment
639 High Road
Tottenham
N17 8BD
Tel 020 8489 1479
Fax 020 8489 5552
I'm afraid I don't have an email address to hand. If someone gets it, please can they come back and post it.
I've asked our councillors if they will support our area and stand up for Harringay's buildings.
Tags for Forum Posts: the beaconsfield
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Liz on
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Well, I'm going to pop in the two South Harringay schools and the Catholic Church in Mattison. As you exit the Harringay Passage from Warham into Pemberton the glimpse of the church across the schools makes for a fine view, imperfectly captured here one winter day
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Permalink Reply by Old-Age-Emporium(OAE) on
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Excellent nomination, Liz.
I'm sure location and incidental vistas should have as much to do with listing as the architecture and historical significance of the particular building itself. Think of the fuss they've made over preserving the sightlines of St Paul's Cathedral these past 350 years or so.
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It was Jonathan Meades, I think, who warned developers to remember that one person's residence was another person's view out of their window and to make sure that they made it beautiful to look at, something not heeded at Tottenham Hale I fear.
CABE, those hopeless romantics of the built environment have just commissioned a report to show that 80% of people think that beauty matters
I'm guessing that the other 20 % are the people that build tower blocks in the Lee Valley or 'developments' like the Coliseum across the road from J C Cathles finest work at the Salisbury.
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Permalink Reply by John McMullan on
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Or they're the people who shop at Sainsbury's in the wee small hours in their pyjamas... ew!
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Well, they've got until March next year and they seem to looking for ways to continue in the form of non- government funded body perhaps in the same way as the old Civic Trust was re-invented.
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What is the bamboo screen there for? It's not very classy and it certainly wouldn't be allowed if the building were listed.
Ummm... it's not so people outside the school can't see children inside the school playing is it?
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Yes, but it's only in front of the nursery playground, not the whole perimeter. Sign of the times, I'm afraid John, better than metal mesh or concrete walls. I don't think that local listing is a statutory thing, more like an inventory of notable buildings and structures, so there wouldn't be restrictions.
Why not nominate the Harringay Passage John?
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Permalink Reply by pamish on
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Blimey. Is there anywhere over 50 years old that is not listed? All the places Hugh found noteworthy on this page are listed.
The only road in Page Green they have missed is mine, should I be offended?
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Permalink Reply by Omotn on
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I entirely support Hugh's attempt to update this list, but while it is nice to have a list, the listing needs to have a purpose. The extract from a LBH interweb manuscript contains the expression "seek to ensure". I haven't found the relevant UDP page. Does any one know if, how, when, how vigorously this seeking to ensure is pursued? I'm sure there are horror stories of occasions on which the listed merits have been ignored by enthusiastic developers. I know there are conservation area advisory committees - do these have the teeth, energy, enthusiasm they need to monitor the list. Do planning officers check it before granting/denying planning permission. I ask only because I want to know.
"Additional conservation considerations are given to the alteration of these buildings and the Council will seek to ensure that the special character of such buildings is protected and enhanced. Planning policy relating to local listed buildings is in the Unitary Development Plan (UDP).
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Permalink Reply by Hugh on
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Relevant chapter from UDP attached (1st document, attached at the foot of this comment).
However, once consultations are finished a new Local Development Framework (LDF) will replace the Unitary Development Plan (UDP). I think the part relevant to conservation is included in the Core Strategy and is currently out for consultation. The second document below is the relevant part from the Core strategy - sounds perhaps a bit stronger?
Within that is a map showing conservation areas in the borough. Notably Harringay is one of only two wards in the borough without even the hint of a conservation area:
(Click the map to enlarge) - Attachments:
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conservation-3.pdf, 98 KB -
chapter_6.pdf, 528 KB
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