Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!
No council tax paid on Wards corner by Grainger and TFL since 2008. Can this be true?
Wards Corner, N15 empty buildings.
I have been told by my neighbour that Haringey Council have failed to collect any council tax on any of the empty building on the Wards Corner site when they could have claimed thousands of pounds in back revenue for the people of Haringey, how can this be true?
The law was changed back in 2008 allowing councils to claim tax on empty property, thus provide an income and to encourage occupancy of the buildings. This would be over 5 years of lost tax revenue to Haringey.
This would mean that Grainger a company with over 2 billion Pounds of assets appears not to have paid tax on the 2 two empty shop units by Seven Sisters Underground station and hasn't paid on all those empty homes in Suffield Road, n15. They surely must owe the rate payers of Haringey thousand of pounds at the time when we have to tolerate sacking teachers, closing day centres for older persons or youth clubs.
Plus TFL with approximately 10,000 sqm of space at the corner of the High Road and Seven Sisters Road i.e. prime retail space should owe money.
It sounds absolutely appalling that a local Tottenham priest is fined for non payment of his Council tax withheld in protect against the cuts but a multi billion pound companies and TFL get off scot free and maybe their payment would have avoided some cuts.
How can the Council claim they need money when they allow such terrible tax evasion, can anyone tell me more details of these Wards Corner empty buildings and the tax situation?
Tags for Forum Posts: corner, cuts, developement, homes, housing, local, market, shop, tax, wards
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by clyde on
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Dear Alan,
Your statement “I was making a far more limited point. Clyde raised the issue of loss of tax income when a building is empty. Grainger may well agree. And they could point out that while the Wards Corner Coalition’s legal proceedings hold up the development, Grainger are prevented from building and trying to sell/rent the space” is totally incorrect.
These building were all empty before the Wards Corner Coalition stood up for the local people. Haringey Council could have easily asked for council tax on these empty building but it must have choosen not to, that is the important point. Also the previous developer who owned those building by the tube had planned to rebuild them but then sold to Grainger. So no one was prevented from building, renting nor were they all prevented from offering to all pay council tax.
The buildings were even empty before 2008, as I am told it is quite common as it helps run a site down and you see such things all over. The Grainger owned houses were left empty from virtually the date of purchase long before the change in Government advice on taxation on empty building. They could have been offered to social tenants of short leases to rent.
So please do not blame the public for the decision of the council leaders when it could have only been a cold calculated decision to aid a rich company and TFL. I feel it is totally wrong to sack teachers due to the cuts yet offer 2 billion pound companies a cash gift.
Who or where do such council values comes from? Whom drives such a decision not to tax the very rich at the expense of the poor and their education?
Surely Alan you can not support this cash gift or do you and if you do not which council leaders do?
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Permalink Reply by Alan Stanton on
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Clyde, I've told you what I understand is the position with Council Tax on residential premises and "Business Rate" on non-residential property. I don't know about the history of the ownership before Grainger and I'm not going to offer a view about something when I don't know the facts.
Should Haringey collect council tax and business rates when they are due? Yes. But nobody has shown me any clear evidence that it didn't. So we are where you began. Something your neighbour told you based on Freedom of Information Act questions and answers which neither of us has seen.
Sorry if this seems unhelpful. But whatever either of us thinks about Wards Corner, it will soon be finally decided by a Court. Meanwhile there are many other things happening and which have happened in Tottenham and elsewhere in Haringey which need urgent attention.
The thought sometimes occurs to me that so much protest has focused on Wards Corner, it has absorbed energy and effort and resources which could otherwise have been directed at other urgent issues. Like working together to understand and demand changes in the response to the riot.
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That's very cryptic, Pam.
“Good prose should be transparent, like a window pane.”
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Interesting points from Will Hoyle. Though I wouldn't condemn the One Borough fund in such sweeping terms. There may be potentially useful projects there.
Factual issues: I sat on the first Wards Corner application - not an appeal. I haven't re-read those papers recently. (Been a bit busy since then.) But I don't remember them including a detailed previous history of the land ownership. This isn't a usual part of planning applications which are mainly about sites in the present and proposed future changes. But, Mr Hoyle, please let me know if you've looked-up those papers and I've got this wrong. If so, I'll download a copy of the application, take a look, and apologise if I've misled HoL readers.
About the Chief Executive Mr Nick Walkley: Yes, I think I may have been wrong.
What I was vehement about was the risk in taking someone who'd chosen to work for one of the most right-wing privatising councils in London. But so far he has impressed me by a no nonsense approach to poor performance; that he seems committed to openness and transparency; and to senior officers meeting and learning from one another. I was pleased to see him quickly organising walks with councillors and senior officers around different wards.
I gather he may have done some anonymous visits to various places Haringey funds. Hopefully he will have a more informed judgement about which are valuable services and which a waste of public money.
I expect vehement disagreement some time.
(Tottenham Hale ward councillor)
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"I didn't see a wave of senior civil servants resign when the current government came to power."
"Dump f***ing everyone’: the inside story of how Michael Gove’s vicious attack dogs are terrorising the DfE."
- The Independent 15 February 2013.
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Permalink Reply by Clive Carter on
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This is beyond parody.
Oh Pam, stop teasing! Give it a go!
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How can you Parody the awful situation of non collected Council Tax for Wards Corner empty buildings. Involving a company with over two Billion pounds of assets. Yet our council can take tax from pensioners whilst sacking teachers.
Who on the council cabinet approves of this non collection and what are they doing about it?
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I have seen the FOI, I think you need to get a "shouty" unless you support the council sacking teachers instead of collecting tax. Why not ask the council yourself.
It is outrageous that the council can sack teachers yet offer tax breaks to a corporation with 2 billion pounds of assets.
Personally I do not think that is even "shout" enough.
Feel free to shout out how you got on with more FOI on the empty building on the wards corer site and their tax status since 2008.
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Clyde, do please post the full Freedom of Information Act questions and answers on HoL - and anywhere else people can see them and form their own view.
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Clyde, council impropriety with respect to property developers is not limited to tax breaks.
In 2007 the council—in its efforts to sell off Alexandra Palace—created a Licence to the premature occupier, that conveyed between £1,487,000 and £2,023,000* of direct cash subsidy from council coffers to the ordinary trading operations of the developer.
This is detailed in Walklate Report #2 (also, one can Google "Licence to Firoka"). How badly did Firoka (Alexandra Palace) Ltd., need this help?
The principal and controlling party is Firoz Kassam, one of the richest men in Britain.
This is just dismissed now as ancient history. After all, it's only money.
*depending on the method of calculation
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