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Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!

Anyone know what's the deal? Traffic backed up most of the way southbound to Tesco Metro on Green Lanes past copshop 

Tags for Forum Posts: low traffic neighbourhoods, traffic

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There's an additional school street in the area being proposed for Alexandra Primary (near the job centre and the Decorium close to Wood Green Common) which might affect things too ...I want everyone to be able to breathe clean air, and get around! Wishing on the impossible! 

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The polemical nature of the LTN discussion seems to result in an inability or lack of willing in many of the pro-LTN members to even acknowledge that the LTNs are a significant part of the current traffic problems.

We see the exact pathology in many of the Brexit supporters who can't acknowledge that even 'part' of our economic malaise is due to having left the EU.

"It's too soon to tell"

"Things will get better" 

"It's the roadworks (Ukraine)". 

The nature of the argument appears to rob people of their mental acuity, and possibly their intellectual integrity. 

It's really simple, Chris. LTNs take time for the traffic to settle. And in most cases generally result in less traffic, less pollution and more walking, cycling and a healthier neighbourhood. This is proven and empirical. Because of the nature of this, their effectiveness must be counted in months and years, not days and weeks. They are not a short term solution, their positive impact is not necessarily immediate. This isn't robbing people of mental acuity or intellectual integrity, it's simply the nature of the project. Wait and see. There is always more congestion when they are introduced, because roads that motorists use to rat run, where their satnavs have sent them, have been closed off, pushing that traffic onto main roads. This is logical and expected. And it gradually levels out, over time. The Haringey LTNs may be atypical. It's unlikely, but only time will tell. I am pro-LTN, but I absolutely concede that they might be part of the current traffic problems, which do seem to be a bit of a perfect storm of LTNs, roadworks and burst water mains. But usually, this is a short-term problem with a longer term solution. Can I ask why, Chris, that maybe seen through this lens, you're not prepared to give it a bit more of a fair shake?

I applaud you, Rory, for so clearly exemplifying my point.

I've acknowledged your point, agreed with it, and politely asked you to give a policy a reasonable amount of time before deciding against it, explaining the reasoning. Have a great evening!

Rory — You might want to consider the views of a huge number of Ladder residents who saw the traffic flows in their streets and on Wightman Road increase exponentially after the Gardens were closed in a de facto LTN something like 20 years ago. Many will tell you they’re still waiting for the “experiment” to bed in and all that displaced traffic to “evaporate” as we’re all so often told it will.

LTNs are great for those who live in them. For the test of us the cost is even more clogged up and polluted major traffic routes and longer journey times. You watch, the experiment will continue. Haringey will declare it a success and extend the LTN schemes. Traffic will be even more congested on major routes. Solving one problem by exacerbating another isn't solving the problem

I complained to Haringey formslly about LCNs. This is their prompt 

 

Your complaint about poor traffic management in Haringey.

 

Our understanding of your complaint is that you are unhappy with the recently implemented trial St Ann’s Low-Traffic Neighbourhood (LTN) because of the traffic queues in Green Lanes.

 

The Lower Traffic Neighbourhoods are vital to the Council's Haringey Streets for People programme. It is an ambitious strategy to improve air quality, reduce the harmful effect of traffic in residential areas and improve road safety.  We want to make our neighbourhoods welcoming, liveable and inclusive spaces for all residents where it is safe and enjoyable to walk, cycle, and use buggies and wheelchairs

 

The anticipated effect of the LTN is to see traffic levels diminish over time as drivers adjust their travel and routing methods and Haringey Council is committed to the well-being of its residents. we will monitor bus journey times, air quality and traffic volumes on main, boundary and residential roads (please see attached the monitoring strategy for St Ann's). Monitoring data can also be found on My Haringey; To access the data, click on the "My Maps" tab and click the" Streets for People – Monitoring" in the "Map" Category on the left-hand side. Please note that all data is raw and has not yet been subject to any analysis.

 

We are always happy to receive advice and comments on how we can improve our methods and processes. Whilst we recognise your concern about the effect of the changes, the LTNs have been implemented under an Experimental Traffic Order (this can be in place for a minimum of 6 months and a maximum of 18 months). We will monitor the area to see how it works before deciding whether to amend, remove or make the trial scheme permanent. You can formally object to the scheme within the first six months by emailing traffic.orders@haringey.gov.uk and stating the grounds for objection.

 

Once the scheme has settled, we will appoint a third-party consultancy responsible for analysing the data and preparing the final monitoring report. In line with our Monitoring Strategy, we will also launch resident perception surveys within a few months after implementation, allowing everyone to have their say on their experience with the scheme. The Council will notify all residents of the upcoming surveys via a letter and other means of communication. The final monitoring report will include data collected as part of these surveys. Whilst these surveys are not live yet, we have communication channels with our residents open for their comments.

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