Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!
Turning the jerk dial down
Like most communities, both online and off HoL has a few moments of tension and some grumpiness. That's life. However, it doesn't mean that we can't improve on things.
A few people have told me that they know someone who's been put off from contributing or even visiting HoL because of some of the behaviour on the site...and that's a shame. Liz and I work hard to try and make the overall tone positive and the environment safe. Our visitor statistics show that HoL is getting more and more popular. We're growing the number of unique daily visitors every month and according to figures provided by the Hornsey Journal, we get twice the number of visitors as their sites, but could we do more to make HoL and even better place to visit?
The other day I was reading social media guru Clay Shirky writing on dealing with bad behaviour in online forums:
That provides some options for turning the jerk dial down. One is to make identity valuable........... Another approach is to partition public platforms, thus reducing the incentive to publicly act out.
Both points resonate with me when thinking about forums in general and left me with two questions:
- Do we have a need to turn the jerk dial down on HoL?
- If so, how should we put Shirky's insights into practice?
On partitioning the platform, the obvious answer is to do away with, or make less central, the latest activity feature. I've tried that before and was met with a storm of protest. It remains an option.
Any thoughts on the general issues and HoL responses most welcome.
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Michael Anderson on
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I'm from Warham and pretty sensible.
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Permalink Reply by Danzigger on
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Bah! I can't believe I've missed out on two days of this discussion - I love this kind of thing! Argument, opinion, disagreement, conflict: it's what web forums are all about.
There probably are comments made here that some people find intimidating. Some people are more confident than others. Or more opinionated. Or better informed. Or can spell more better than others. Or perhaps they just don't agree with what someone else has said. All these people with their different skills and competencies are what make up the community. So let them speak here.
I don't really believe that people who don't post now would post in the future if the "jerk dial" was turned down; I think they'd find another reason not to get involved.
The "jerk dial" of every forum needs to find it's own level. I think that here it tends towards "reasonable and proportionate." Let's keep it as it is.
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Permalink Reply by John D on
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One thing that stands out is the constant unpleasant sniping at Crouch End and the residents.
Some of us don't want Green Lanes turning into Crouch End.
some C-list Crouch End celeb
a cynical Crouch End-ite ploy
that’s what makes it real London, and not a micro Crouch End.
yummy mummies with 3 wheeled buggies from Crouch End.
Well it is Crouch End, let them eat cake
the twig carving shops of Crouch End
If I lived in Crouch End I wouldn't want to visit or contribute to HOL.
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Permalink Reply by Anette on
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Someone clearly has serious Crouch End envy. I guess the Crouch Enders could say:
Some of us don't want Green Lanes turning into Crouch End.
* We certainly would not have Crouch End turning into Green Lanes!
some C-list Crouch End celeb
* some nobody on the dole
a cynical Crouch End-ite ploy
* a I will burn your shop down if you don't do what I say Green Lanes threat
that’s what makes it real London, and not a micro Crouch End.
* Crouch End is real London, only the nice part.
yummy mummies with 3 wheeled buggies from Crouch End.
* Drunk people with fags and cheep cider.
Well it is Crouch End, let them eat cake
* Well it's Green Lanes, let them eat kebabs
the twig carving shops of Crouch End
* the lovely betting shops of Green Lanes
I live on the Ladder if anyone wondered.. There's 2 sides, as John D pointed out, please don't let your Crouch End envy get the better of you, people..
*ducks behind a pile of fly tipped rubbish*
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Permalink Reply by Mr Growbag on
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I have never had 'Crouch End Envy' for the simple reason that it's part of what I perceive to be my neighbourhood. It's under half an hour's stroll away- so, living in Harringay I get the benefit of cheaper house prices/rents AND easy access to all of the stuff in Crouchy (and Wood Green, for that matter). It's not like there's a border with armed guards, keeping those of us on the east side of the mainline out!
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Permalink Reply by Pip on
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I've been of the opinion for a long while now that it would be better to have the latest activity feed set lower on the front page, and the top 10 most recently discussed topics centre stage (with the last comment on that topic highlighted). This would allow the topics with the most interest to continue to be easily seen and commented on, but would keep a range of topics always on display.
The issue I've found which stops me commenting as often as I would otherwise do is that the first thing I see is often several posts all on the same topic which I'm not very engaged with (eg a banner on a bridge) and it's not so easy to see the topics I may want to comment on.
I'm not a shrinking violet and I do enjoy my fairly infrequent posting but obviously only on topics I'm interested in - would it not be worth changing the front page for a month or two to see what people think?
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Permalink Reply by Hugh on
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Thanks Pip. That sounds like a useful idea. I think making that change on a trial basis makes sense. That way if folk don't like it we can always go back.
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Permalink Reply by Takaokagiejin on
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I like Pips suggestion
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Hi Hugh,
Have you considered whether people’s attitudes towards posting have changed since the move to an open forum (no need to sign in to access HoL; this was implemented without prior warning/consultation, and then refined following user feedback to keep profile info out of the public domain)?
Does this have a bearing on why people may read, but not post? Having confidence in the control of data will materially affect any decision whether or not to participate. To this end can you answer the following;
1) What is HoLs attitude to content posted by members on this site? Does ownership of the content remain with the poster? It is unclear from your Terms of Service what happens to content if an account is deleted – I notice that you have © 2011 on the bottom of each page, does this mean HoL is trying to assert copyright over our data or do you agree that it remains with the poster? Wouldn’t a Creative Commons approach be more appropriate here?
2) Although it is unclear from the Terms of Service where HoL is hosted, I notice that it refers to the DCMS (an US copyright act) which suggests that the hosting company is US based – is everyone aware of the implications regarding the US Patriot Act and what this may mean in regards to UK Data Protection legislation?
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Thanks for your thoughtful comments IJP. I have looked at the 'openness effect' and both visitor numbers and postings have gone up.
1. People can choose whether to leave or delete their content on departure and no, we don't assert rights over content posted by other people.
2. The site is hosted by Ning in California. No idea what everyone is aware of. If you have some links to credible info on this, I'm sure some people would be interested.
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