Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!
Sandero
From the Haringey planning page it seems they put an application to convert a travel agents into a coffee shop and install a new extractor flue in the private yard at the back. The application is refused. So what do they do? Convert the travel agent AND the rear yard into a restaurant complete with seats, tables and (natch) smoking in the rear yard.
Anyone know what is going on here?...
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by PaulG on
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I think that there is no point wasting time with local councillors. The head of the planning department needs to be contacted and if that doesn't work - go higher. It is a joke that you can open a restaurant without any planning permission whatsoever and carry on for a year.
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Permalink Reply by john e on
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I agree, but I have repeatedly contacted Lorcan Lynch at Haringey enforcement, only to receive replies promising me updates in due course.....then nothing.
If everybody who has posted on this discussion contacted Lorcan at lorcan.lynch@haringey.gov.uk
then perhaps he will be stung into action. Even if that is only to tell us what is happening ( if anything is ).
To be honest, there is little to be gained from posting on this discussion thread if we dont take it further with planning enforcement.
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Permalink Reply by John McMullan on
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You know I'm afraid I'm not anti this restaurant but then again, I don't live near it and don't intend to dine there so, none of my business. Just a suggestion but it's worked for me twice recently, get your smartphone out and shoot a little video. Upload it to youtube and then post it here and send it to planning.
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There are three separate issues here.
1. Planning. The council's planning dept. are still supposed to be taking legal action to have the out-door structures removed. All appeal deadlines have passed. The indoor restaurant area is legal and has permission. Interested parties should email: planning.enforcement@haringey.gov.uk. As most people know, planning have been totally silent on this issue for many months.
2. Noise. The council's noise team should be informed of any incident like the one last Saturday. They need to have complaints on record before action can be taken. john e's post has full details but, as he says, report noise:
3. Licence. The restaurant is in breech of several terms of its licence. It is licensed to play music until 23:00 and close at 23:30. It should have notices up telling patrons to be quiet outside. It should have a vestibule to keep noise inside. No music played there should be audible "at or within the site boundary of any residential property". There is a complaint form HERE. I also suggest people email:
licensing@haringey.gov.uk or:
kendra.olson@haringey.gov.uk
Full details of the licence are HERE:
Posting here is of limited use of course; if people want action to be taken they must try the relevant departments above. But posting here isn't completely useless. People are more likely to feel confident in complaining if they see that their community agrees with them. We don't all agree on every nuance of this issue I'm sure but one thing we can agree on is that it is unacceptable to run what should be a quiet restaurant as a late night club complete with brawling on the street.
If, like me, this is your main concern (I'm not anti this restaurant either) I think the best course of action is to report the incident to the noise team and to the license team. They want evidence. Invite them to request a police report from Saturday night. Also quote the relevant parts of the licence (see links above). And a video from your phone is a great idea.
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@ Austin, you say
The indoor restaurant area is legal and has permission.
Are you sure? You read my OP? It certainly was converted into a restaurant after being REFUSED permission for the conversion.
I also don't agree it's not an eyesore: I think the front decking is hideous.
I will send some emails and let you know how I get on. This is getting silly now.
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I meant the initial conversion wasn't an eyesore Paulie - just a reasonable, inoffensive looking indoor restaurant, the additions to this I'm not too keen on.
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I am also not anti it, and when I saw a new local restaurant opening I was quite pleased; the restaurant itself is not an eyesore, and the staff seem friendly. But what is incredibly frustrating is their lack of consideration for the local residents and blatant disregard for planning and licensing rules. And just as a disclaimer (before anyone twigs that I don't actually live within hearing distance of the place...although almost) I'm voicing my concerns due to 2 of my closest friends (and their young daughter) living directly next door to the place and witnessing the impact it has on them first hand.
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@Paulie - yea I'm sure about the planning. One of my initial gripes about this whole thing was that the planning was granted retrospectively on the final appeal. I don't think I would've objected to the plans submitted (since they don't include any outdoor area) but we were never given the chance since the public can't find out about appeals easily. You really have to suspect one is happening and go searching for it. Hence there's no public involvement which seems very wrong. But yea - I called up ages ago and got a note of the appeal. Don't even think that's available online.
I agree Katy. I was pleased initially too and the people are very nice. But I need to sleep and so do the several elderly people and new families (and everyone else!) in close proximity. The lack of consideration is astounding given that they seem so nice. The other thing is - it's always empty (except Fri and sat night) and I'd actually go there a fair bit if they weren't playing music in my house every weekend. Sigh...
Good luck Paulie.
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Ok I have a little info about Sandero.
In respect of the license ( for alcohol & music ) they are operating under temporary event notices. These are granted automatically without reference to any objections (other than the police) and they are entitled to 12 per year.
As they are in breach of the original license they are not operating under it. Which means they are NOT permitted to serve alcohol or play music at present ( other than when on a TEN ). They can however continue to trade as a restaurant.
In respect of planning enforcement, i.e the legality and future of the covered area at the rear; I have been told that they have not complied with any orders to remove it and a prosecution is being prepared and is pending. This should result in this area being removed...eventually.
Instead of Lorcan, I spoke to Eubert Malcom ( who I think heads up the enforcement dept ), he is perhaps a better point of contact than Lorcan Lynch.
In respect to the premises license ( sandero's license to trade as a restaurant), an application can be made for it to be reviewed. See below.
This is probably a draconian move...? As we dont object to the restaurant per se, just its breach of planning and license conditions...... your thoughts please on this.
REQUESTED FORMS FOR THE REVIEW OF A PREMISES LICENCE
As requested please find the forms required to apply for the review of a Premises Licence under the Licensing Act 2003.
Copies of the application must be sent to all Responsible Authorities. Please find these detail enclosed.
An application for the review of a Premises License must be based on one or more of the Licensing Objectives:
- · The prevention of crime and disorder;
- · Public safety;
- · The prevention of public nuisance;
- · The protection of children from harm.
Once the request for the review is made the licensing authority will advertise the application for 28 consecutive days in the following ways:
- · clearly display an A4 size notice immediately on or outside the premises;
- · display the same notice in the licensing authority offices;
- · advertise the review of the licence on the Council website;
If the request for a review is not rejected then the licensing authority will hold a hearing to consider the application, unless all parties agree that this is unnecessary. The licensing authority will write to you with the date and time of the hearing and will inform you of the procedure to be followed at the hearing.
If you have any queries please do not hesitate to contact me on the above details.
Yours sincerely,
Kendra Olson
Licensing Administrator
Haringey Council
Tel: 020 8489 5544
E-mail: kendra.olson@haringey.gov.uk
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If they are just ignoring the current licence, I don't really see the point in having it reviewed. I don't want to get the restaurant shut down (I don't even think that's possible anyway). Surely, in anything like a sensible world, licensing would just act on the breech of license and - you know - ask them to stop it. Is there even the remotest point to a licence otherwise?
It seems like the best course of action is to pursue enforcing the current licence before anything else. Did they say why they aren't acting on that?
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Permalink Reply by Hugh on
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Walked past the other day and saw how they've kitted out the outside bit. I must say it put me in mind of a canvas and wood fortress. Surely this must count as a structure, no matter how flimsy.
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It is (officially) a structure yes Hugh. There are more substantial structures behind the cloth too. Planning have been "preparing prosecution" for around 7 months now to have the outdoor structures removed. With the noise cancelling properties of canvas and live, amplified music until 1/2am on weekends you see why people are upset.
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