Harringay online

Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!

So I can hear many people being pleased about this, but I can promise you fining people for jumping red lights doesnt work

its the 2nd time I have been fined and this time it cost me £50 on a very rainy monday by a very grumpy young PC- not happy- all cars staitonary- and no pedestrians

But will it stop me ( or other serial red light jumpers like me)- well its a BIG FAT NO-

Its just now I will have to make sure there are no police cars in the vicinity- So infact instead of making the roads safer, instead of me previously doing a thorough check of the road of any cars, pedestrians, other cyclists., I now have to check for police which means Im possibly less than 100% focused on everything else

So to put this in context

I am a middle age woman who has been cycling  in london on a daily basis for the last 30years. I have been knocked off quite a few times( absolutely none of them my fault)

 2 of my accidents in my early years of cycling where  when i was leaving traffic lights- so I learnt like many other cyclists, traffic lights are dangerous places to stop- So provided its totally clear, get on your way. The more cyclists on the road, the worst junctions seem with the cluster of cyclists trying to find room with cars behind getting impatient and trying to squeeze through dangerously narrow gaps

So you are never going to convince me or many other cyclists its safer to stop at red lights- although i might be a bit richer

So any PC PlODS out there dont waste your time especially on a rainy day - go and catch real crims

So i know many wont agree wth this, but unfortunately a few cyclists give us all a bad name- such as cyclists

who jump lights in a dangerous way( when there are cars around

cyclists who go on pavments and weave around pedestians- scarring them

cyclists who dont stop at pedestrian crossings when people are crossing-terrible!!!!!!!!!!

But something needs to be done with all these recent deaths, and I would be really interested in what the circumstances were- i would guarantee it wasnt due to jumping a light-unless of course the person had been drinking etc

Most bad accidents/fatalities happen by people obeying the law- so the law needs to be changed

And when are pedestrians going to be fined for jay walking across roads and knocking cyclists off

I got sent flying only 2 months ago by a pedestrian running out in front of me on green lanes, close to the ale emporium- the 3rd time a  pedestrian has knocked me off over the years

Right Rant finished

And anyone/cyclist wants to make our roads safer, see the petition below


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The answer is in the word 'serious' - you are more likely to be seriously injured by a bigger vehicle. It's not rocket science.

The reason that the ire is directed towards cyclists is that it was started by a cyclist who thinks they are aboce the law - no ta  druver. If you can direct me towards a post by a driver who thinks they are above the law and is stating their intention to continue ignoring it - I will be sure to go and tell them that they are complete idiot too.  Sound fair?

 "you are more likely to be seriously injured by a bigger vehicle" - this is precisely the point. 

There is a serious debate to be had about road safety - in the shadow of the number of cyclists who have been killed on London roads in the past couple of weeks.  There are real questions about whether it is always best for cyclists to cross certain junctions with other road vehicles. Various reports have been pointed to on this thread that suggest that following the ordinary rules of the road can be dangerous for cyclists.

As Ant noted earlier in this thread it is very interesting that no motorists are discussing their own lawbreaking. I would say that 10 minutes observation on Wightman road would give you a number of examples of law breaking that potentially have very serious consequences. Such law breaking is very common place - nobody tries to justify it, but that does not stop lots of people doing it.     

You haven't read my posts on motorists speeding on Wightman Rd ? And about drivers ignoring red lights ?

Search " Reply by John D 7 hours ago

I contacted Nilgun Canver.....

If you want that debate, ask about speed limits and parking tickets 

I imagine that equal venom would be directed at any driver ( not only motorists ) who admitted to deliberately running red lights and announced that they intended to continue doing so. ( see original post )

Many people are confused about insurance.

Of course you can claim damages against a cyclist who injures you. The right to sue for damages exists whether or not someone is insured.

Insurance is to cover the driver/cyclist/workman etc against someone suing them, so in the event it happens the insurer pays for the claim rather than the individual. It has been made compulsory for drivers because the level of damage a driver could cause is so high that most people would not be able to pay that level of damage claim and would be forced into bankruptcy, serving no-one's benefit. 

Over the years, the motor insurance industry has standardised claims so they are handled between insurance companies rather than by individuals through the courts. This makes many assume that an insurance company is required before a claim can be made but this is incorrect.

Although many regular cyclists are insured via organisations like LCC and CTC, to date it has not been made compulsory for cyclists because the risk of causing significant damage is far lower.

The fact that a motor insurance industry has developed at all should give one cause for thought when considering the relative damage caused by poor driving and poor cycling.

I am a cyclist and cycle to work doing 50 miles a week. I stop at every single red light no matter what time of day or night it is, and no matter how clear or busy the roads are - with absolutely no exceptions whatsoever.

I am absolutely sick to the back teeth of other cyclists jumping red lights ALL the time. The arrogance thinking that the rules of the road don't apply to them is extraordinary. I cycle down Green Lanes over Manor House to Moorgate and back again every day. If cyclists follow the rules of the road - and yes it applies to you too - you will have absolutely no issues with traffic at all. The number of times I have seen cyclists forcing pedestrians to either stop or slow their pace to ensure they don't get hit by an ignorant selfish law breaking cyclist numbers scores of times in my daily commute by bike to and from work.

It seems to me that it's the ones who constantly BREAK THE LAW, are the first to whinge and moan about poor them when they get hit or fined - well tough quite frankly.

If you ride according to the law you will have no issue with traffic. if you don't, then don't complain if you get hit or fined.

I would like to reiterate I am a cyclist and not a motorist.

I have been cycling daily for 21 years and not been hit nor even had a close call because I follow the rules of the road.

"Jay walking" is not an offence in this country by the way - and also if you bother to read the Highway Code it says give way to pedestrians at all times, whether you like it or not - it's the law. It's also very arrogant and unwise to incite other cyclists on this website to actively break the law just so they can "get on your way". Such a waste of your time and effort worrying about other cars, cyclists, pedestrians and heaven forbid police cars in case they catch you deliberately breaking the law which you think personally doesn't apply to you when you could be "100% focused" on looking at a red light and then going when it's green.

Quite agree. The arrogance (and self-righteousness) of some cyclists about this is astounding. I honestly can't believe anyone thinks it's justifiable.From a pedestrian's point of view, a bike is a vehicle. End of story. When the lights are red and the man is green, that is a signal to pedestrians that it is safe to cross - not "there are no cars, sure, but there might be an idiot cyclist who thinks they're so oppressed that the Highway Code doesn't apply to them and they are somehow not a vehicle in this situation." It's all about the expectations of other road users and safety. Anyone who doesn't think the law applies to them is selfish and irresponsible and needs to grow up, frankly

And sorry, but it's not a tiny minority, although I wish it was. There was an article In yesterday's Standard I think about a camera set up at a couple of junctions and filming over the course of a day. HALF of all cyclists didn't bother to stop. That pretty much tallies with my experience and I imagine that of most pedestrians.

(Of course, that doesn't excuse idiot pedestrians walking blithely out into the road texting, on phone etc against the red man, and not even looking before crossing which I've seen a worrying number of times round here and lots of near-misses with traffic. But that's a whole other issue ...)

I think pedestrians should also be banned from crossing at red lights. It is very hard to teach your children good road safety when there are so many variables. Children find it impossible to determine the speed of a vehicle approaching and whether it is safe to walk.

Also, plenty of cars jumping red lights.  A camera by the pedestrian crossing by Hampden Road on Wightman Road whould make a nice little earner.

I've been cycling to work for about 10 years and some cyclists have always jumped red lights in a dangerous way, giving us all a bad name.

What is newer is cars, vans and buses routinely jumping red lights. You typically see 5-10 vehicles following through a junction after the lights have gone from amber to red. Why does noone mention this? Much more dangerous than being hit by a cyclist.

Jay walking is a US law and does not exist in the UK so not sure about that point.

Remember - amber means STOP unless it would be dangerous to do so. It does not mean speed up so you can get through before it goes to red.

John I thought you might appreciate this.



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