Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!
Street sleepers
I wandered down green lanes yesterday at around 8:30 and noticed several people sleeping rough! Including a man and a women! Both sides of the lanes.
Has this problem got out of control? Is there anything the council can do?
Has this problem got out of control? Is there anything the council can do?
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by james walsh on
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jj you make a very good point, thanks
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Permalink Reply by Finsbury Park Ranger on
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Lovely point , well made.
However I would challenge your last point. It's not just about housing. I work for a homeless charity and all of our clients have a place to sleep but many chose to beg on the street as a way to fund their drug or alcohol or gambling addiction and sometimes lose their room / home because these problems intermittently get more acute.
Often the problem is that some people just don't want to live in their own skin or own life. I think that's because their basic emotional needs have just never been met. So they ....
- don't think they are good at anything
- never felt part of a good team
- often had their privacy invaded
- never felt like their life had a purpose
- never made any decent friends
- never had much intimacy with one other person
- never felt valued etc
Also they never learned how to use their key resources such as
- getting a good nights sleep
- healthy diet and exercise
- able to build rapport with others
- use metaphor to help resolve problems
- able to sit above their thoughts and analyse them
All these problems require lots of
work to remedy, certainly
more than good housing policy, they require a society that cares to start putting these things right and a welfare state that doesnt just write people off. I would argue that a system that links financial support ( and / or free prescribed alcohol or drugs) with the individual beginning to address these problems with the help of experienced organisations that help such people is the right way forward.
'Housing first' maybe but a lot more work second.
The last issue is immigration, you can't provide such services to an unlimited amount of people.
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Permalink Reply by JJ on
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I'm not going anywhere near your last point, other than to say the issue is more a lack of planning rather than immigration per se. But I understand a lot of what you say, it's thoughtful and considered. There is no simple answer to your point about the damage that modern society can do to individuals, but as a society if we cannot provide a safe, secure and affordable home for us all in our local areas with our community networks then we are failing in one of our primary duties. The points you raise are true, but they cannot be addressed without the underpinning of secure and affordable decent homes for all. We don't want to add homelessness to the existing problems of struggling people
Economically our housing system is a disaster. It sucks money out of the economy, dead money going to service debt to banks rather than being spent stimulating the wider economy. The human consequences we see on green lanes
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The problem is as you increase the quality of your services you automatically increase the demand for them with open borders. Its a bit like making better roads, which in turns increases the number of car users.
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I just find it odd that your "empathy and humanity" don't extend to doing anything practical to assist....only judging me for trying to do something tangible to help
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I don't think your advocacy of cracking down on homeless people on green lanes, basically for being homeless, will do much tangible to help. Other than maybe help you not having to see them anymore. When you contacted no second night out did you tell the people you were going to do this. Did you ask if this was something they wanted?
Unfortunately you or I cannot provide them with a home. I think the most effective way of helping is to fight for the rights of homeless and badly housed people. Don't vote for parties with tterrible housing policies. Pressure your elected representative.
People need rights. Without that there is no recourse, other than to charitable crumbs.
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People have rights already....but there is no recourse for people that make themselves intentionally homeless....in the case of the couple under the bridge they were provided with temporary housing then on their 2nd night threw a huge drugs party and were thrown out the next day.... that kind of behaviour doesn't deserve anyone's sympathy in my view
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Who told you that? Did they say that's what happened? Again though, you're blaming homeless people for being homeless. And what rights do you think homeless people have? I'd be interested to know
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That information came from the horse''s mouth... I was waiting to meet a friend off the overground and heard them laughing and joking about what a great party it was...worth spending a night in jail over...and on the establishments proprietor''s injuries they inflicted that "f*** him he should known we'd be partying" and that he had it coming...genuinely lovely people.....as for rights...Google the legislation for yourself;
The Housing (Homeless Persons) Act 1977
Part 7 of the Housing Act 1996
Homelessness Act 2002 -
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You've assessed their homelessness status and their morality from half an overheard conversation? And based on that have determined if they are deserving of help?
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And on my direct conversations with them and the Council, yes... all along you've assumed that my views aren't based on fact but that's not the case... and I do think assault is immoral... I'm old fashioned like that
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Clearly these people need to do something positive with their lives. Why can't they join HOL and spend their days moaning about Harringay, using metaphor and methadone like the rest of us?
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