Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!
Events at Finsbury Park - have your say!
Hey all, I noticed during Wireless a lot of people were disgruntled during the event and after with the lack of clear up so here's your chance to have a say http://applications.haringey.gov.uk/haringey-snap11-survey-ll.htm?k...
Tags for Forum Posts: finsbury park, finsbury park events
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Hugh on
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To learn more about the background to the survey - see this post.
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Permalink Reply by tigha on
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well I put in my feedback- mostly positive, apart from the need for a lot more loos inside so people dont feel the need to pee else where
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Permalink Reply by JLJones on
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My experience as a local resident... before Wireless there wasn't much glass or plastic in the grass, just the usual piles of litter from overflowing bins. Afterward there was loads of glass and plastic as described, large pieces of steel from site construction, the remains of cable ties that had been cut and left, screws and nails, timber, palettes, etc etc.
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Permalink Reply by Protheroe O'Shea on
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Look at the you tube clips of the wireless gatecrashers . You will see in some clips of people throwing bottles at the security staff and police. One or two bottles smash against the wall. Other bottles that didn't break, and perhaps not thrown by anyone, tend to get smashed buy the parks lawn mower.
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I doubt the bar owners were allowed to sell glass bottles directly to the public . Nevertheless, many would have had sold booze from glass bottles decanted into plastic glasses. Any one who has ever worked in a bar will know that it would have been very easy for bottles to break and end up on the floor, put in a bin bags and slice through the bag and end up in the grass. Law of averages suggests that out of 40,000 people some will no doubt bring a glass bottles and leave them on the floor. Video evidence proves beyond doubt that a handful of the gatecrashers clearly had glass bottles on them and happily used them as missiles .
Just to reiterate I am pro the park being used for concerts just not ones this big. -
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Might help to clarify a couple of things, this from a humble resident who lives close to the park in question. In science and medicine there's anecdotal and empirical evidence. So when you go to your GP they ask lots of questions, take a history and give you a clinical/physical examination. The anecdotal counts for a lot because the empirical can't describe emotions, pain and how you feel. Same with the state of the park post Wireless, except this time the anecdotal is what people like me saw with our own eyes and the empirical is the photographs some of us took.
You seem obsessed with this notion we all carry around preconceived ideas so I can only assume, with respect, thats what you're doing as I certainly don't. There's a lot to like about Finsbury park but compared to Clissold Park its a poor relation and that could well be down to the lack of love from the council that runs it and seeks to sweat more money from it rather than see it as a green space for all to enjoy. For the record the amount of broken glass and other detritus left immediately after Wireless was dangerous and we were assured it wouldn't happen. With respect, this is a fact, not a complaint.
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Permalink Reply by Michael Anderson on
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It was difficult to know quite where to put this post on a rather tangled thread so sorry it's attached to yours Osbawn. It doesn't relate to your comment.
If you were to apply some logic to this the argument probably would be -
How likely is it that in a crowd of X thousand people, some had glass containers and that some of these got broken - highly likely I would suggest.
How likely is broken glass seen after an event of this scale to be from event goers - again fairly likely although you can't discount some of it being from subsequent park users and activities
Whose job was it to clear detritus at the end of the event - it seems this was clearly part of the ccontact with the event organisers
Is the amount a detritis greater than would be found after an ordinary period of time in the park - I haven't seen it but going by what has been reported that seems to be the case.
So logically, the bulk of detritis, although probably not all, was probably from the event and the organisers had a duty to clear it which they seem to have failed in.
This seems to be a case where Haringey should be persuing the organisers to recoup the cost of the additional clear up and look at what measures can be put in place to ensure that this doesn't happen again at future events
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That was kind of my point but you said it so much better!
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Localist, I think we probably agree on one point. Anecdotes aren't a good basis for making decisions. I would want to see a proper post festival review carried out by Haringey that is made public and open to scrutiny. If proper monitoring of the effectiveness of the organisers in relation their contactural obligations has been carried out this should be possible and would be extremely helpful in planning what future action may be needed.
I think that Pavlos also has a good point. It would seem pretty certain that people would listen for free outside of the festival perimeter and that there would be nothing to stop them bring bottles and glasses along with them. If that was the case, and I've no reason to think it isn't, future planning around this circumstance would be useful too.
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Permalink Reply by Konrad B on
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It might be an amenity benefit for those listening on the grass outside the walls, but its no amenity benefit for local residents who have to put up with the noise for three days from 1.30pm 'till 10.30pm, plus sound checks from 10am on festival days and on the preceding day.
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Perhaps you could produce the evidence that supports the truth, whatever that might be?
I write as local resident in Hackney, close to the park.
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The event Ts & Cs also ban legal highs, including nitrous oxide. The ground was littered with hundreds of empty canisters behind where the fence existed. No doubt there'll be a call for proof and there are plenty of photographs and bags of empty canisters that people have picked up. These are simple facts backed up by evidence but contrary to what's been said there's not been a promise by me to share this on this forum... there's a time and a place for that. I can say with certainty that all the broken glass I saw was well inside where the perimeter steel fencing had stood. In the same places there was/is scorched grass where hot cooking fat had been poured out and places where hot cookers of some kind had been placed on the grass. I feel sure 'Localist' will try and tell me I'm wrong and its all because I have a preconceived set of ideas but evidence is evidence. Even just skimming through these Ts&Cs its pretty clear to me that without airport style security it'd be almost impossible to make sure most of them were adhered to in terms of taking in prohibited items. If people can take nitrous oxide in, they probably won't struggle with small spirit bottles. The council and FoFP convened in the park for a post event inspection which turned out to be pointless as Live Nation were still in 'possession' and it was clear to all that the park was in a shambles. The following stakeholders meeting, with only Friends and council staff present was cut short by the chair, perhaps for the same reason.
Tonight I write as local resident and Friend of the Park.
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