Harringay online

Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!

How can we get our local politicians and other public servants to post regularly in this forum?

I've been asked by a shyer member to put up this topic in the hope that more people will contribute their ideas and strategies, inspired by Michael Andersen's post:

Why do so few HoL members post on this site?

I think many of us want to be able to ask them stuff directly on this site (a sort of 'virtual surgery') and get a timely reply.  I'd extend that to Council Officers too. For the politicians, I suppose there are two sorts of posts we might want to make:

a) 'Business' questions/comments about things like why everyday services are not up to scratch etc.  We might have to ban things that really ought to be reported using the Councils reporting facilities, because they can't have an official and an unofficial system for dealing with litter or whatever is counter-productive. Politicians are supposed to be a conduit to power though and if we get together and press for things here and they are 'on duty' then we as a band of locals can work for beneficial change more effectively online than anywhere else. Hugh's Cash Mob for instance is an example of direct, local action that surely Cllrs want to and should be involved in - HoL discussions can create actual local change:

b) 'Political' questions about wider issues like going to war - should that be limited to our MP's though?  Do you want to read non-ward-specific views from your ward Councillor over matters they have no real control over?  The Council can declare the borough a 'Frack-Free Zone' which is an international issue, so it's not as if they are powerless but you know what I mean.

Issues like whether or not there should be cuts or could we not use our savings and borrow against our future wealth as it's so expensive and damaging to cut, cut, cut are relevant to local issues. With so little money and so many in poverty in the East - how can the rich West expect political support for even a single penny? Some Cllrs in the past have, for instance, refused to enact central government cuts and as far as I recall went to prison for it, provoking a law that means they can't simply refuse what Whitehall orders. The Chief Exec of Barnet has now moved jobs to be the Chief Exec of Haringey - do we want to create content that makes local political points as a spur to action?:

So, are those the sorts of discussions we want to have here with our reps and between ourselves?

------------------------------- 

Some UK politicians are very 'internet-savvy'. So as to try to take the measure of our politicians, here are some Councillors who are digital award winners:

Cllr Melvyn Caplan, Westminster City Council was the driving force behind the Tri-Borough’s Customer Led Transformation Programme. This encouraged the adoption of new technologies internally, such as interactive and collaborative meeting room tools and the incorporation of mobile and tablet devices into council work, saving over £1m across the council 

Cllr Muhammed Butt, London Borough of Brent led a transformation of the way that Brent Council operates, incorporating social media into its communications, along with live-streaming of council meetings. By making digital innovation central to the council’s activity, Cllr Butt has helped to ensure that technology is utilized to protect and enhance essential services.

Cllr Stephen Canning, Braintree District Council developed and supported the concept of ‘Braintree hour’ on twitter, which encourages the promotion of local businesses to the community, as well as building community cohesion. The scheme has spread to other council throughout the region.

Cllr Theo Blackwell, London Borough of Camden lead LB Camden’s first digital strategy, encouraging collaboration and new thinking across the council, as well as building partnerships with business. Innovations at the council include coding of after school clubs, expanded public wi-fi access, peer-to-peer lending schemes, and digital inclusion work in social housing.

Cllr Tom Sleigh, City of London Council ran a successful online campaign to reinstate rubbish bins in the City of London, twenty years after they were removed following terrorist activity. He launched a similar campaign to reduce speed limits to 20Mph across the City, using social media, surveys, and innovative methods of sharing information.

--------------------------------

Salford Council has put HoL-like facilities on their own website - would things like this not be better:

Current discussion forums on this website:

As we know that our local politicians don't post here, I'd like to simulate what our councillors/politicians might argue if they did actually post here:

1) It is a relatively low-paid job (starting salary £10,500) and there are literally thousands of meetings to go to - each ward in Haringey, for instance, has loads of community events (many in the evenings) which local Cllrs feel obliged to attend.  Apart from the work of attending numerous policy meetings and dealing with people's problems by chasing Council Officials, most Cllrs put in way more hours than they're supposed to - most have second jobs too I think, some full-time.  So, time spent HoL-typing is a dereliction of their duty to put themselves in front of local people and listen, then take up the issues raised by the face-to-face contacts they say are the only way to do 'real' politics. Be good to see a breakdown of how they spend their time on our behalf.

2) Politicians are 'people people' - all the way up the chain the paramount interaction is always stressed as being 'talking to people', even Cabinet Ministers regularly knock on doors apparently. I think this is an excuse and simply untrue today anyway. Many of the older ones just don't 'get' the internet. Claiming to be 'in touch' with the electorate gives them the chance that they often take to say 'people tell me' or 'my constituents think' when the human truth is that most politicians hear what they want to hear and disregard the rest. Ask them what the main issues are in their wards and they cite things that others would prioritise differently - it's a matter of opinion - they are not accurate surveyors - they could be better at quantifying views. Considering the main things they ignore specifically:

  • Facebook: they don't consider it worth posting to Facebook for instance whereas many here would probably think they ought to. What would be better on Facebook here than there?  Many have the problem that they've already got a 'personal' Facebook page so are stuck with converting it to a 'public' page, which exposes their 'real' friends to a wider exposure than they signed up for.  Almost none of them know how to post in one place and have it 'syndicated' - they are not generally techophiles.
  • Twitter: many councillors do tweet, with the result that we are drowning in Tweets that nobody really looks at and no-one outside their circle ever responds to, so this is proof in their eyes that digital is only for people with time on their hands. We could tweet our Cllrs and they would probably react, but why don't we do that? From a Cllrs point of view, trying to plan how you spend your time must be close to impossible as residents can pop up at any time 24hrs a day with an issue you need to respond to.
  • Blogs: lots of work for very little measurable return. You try writing even one paragraph of political comment - it could take you all afternoon,  Risk that what you wrote might accidentally come back to haunt you or worse, that nobody at all would even bother to read it. Fierce competition from great political bloggers could make yours look pathetic.  You're imposing a liability on future Cllrs to match your output - they won't thank you for that.
  • Newsfeeds - how would it be if a Cllrs auto-posted a newsfeed of all their activities on HoL (say auto-posting their tweets for instance) - do we want that? Wouldn't it be seen as a cynical bit of advertising? Would anyone subscribe to it?

4) Political posts on HoL attract 'history's greatest monster' type vitriol - people make virulent, unsubstantiated personal attacks on the character of local politicians they've never met, often barging into a topic and steering it towards hatred, racism etc.  Any politician who posts here risks a shed-load of this sort of horrible stuff from us - what's in it for the politician?  They'd need an army of clerical help to unpick each accusation and debunk it and none have that resource - if they had they'd spend it otherwise.

5) Geographically HoL is limited to Harringay. Bounds Green has an excellent HoL-type forum for example, so why would anyone from round there post here? We all know that this site reaches all of Haringey (alright, there's better coverage of the West of the borough, but it could have a lot more Eastern stuff if people would bother) but they will say the clue's in the name. There is no one forum for the whole of Haringey and why should there be?  There are no politicians who represent the whole of Haringey (discounting the 'ruling' party on the Council) - it's split by two MP's and lots of ward councillors. So, how would it work, a 'Tottenham' section on HoL for instance?

----------------------------------

To remind you, our local politicians are:

Tottenham: Incumbent: David Lammy MP(Labour)

prospective: any?

Hornsey and Wood Green: Incumbent: Lynne Featherstone MP(Liberal Democrat) 

Prospective: Catherine West (Hornsey and Wood Green,Labour):

any others?

Haringey Councillors:

Councillor
Photograph
Councillor
Political party
Ward
photo of Councillor David Beacham

Councillor David Beacham

Work mobile: 07528 443838

Work: david.beacham@haringey.gov.uk

Liberal Democrats Alexandra
photo of Councillor Liz McShane

Councillor Liz McShane

Work mobile: 07812 677729

Work: liz.mcshane@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Alexandra
photo of Councillor James Patterson

Councillor James Patterson

Work mobile: 07812 677720

Work: james.patterson@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Alexandra
photo of Councillor Clare Bull

Councillor Clare Bull

Work mobile: 07812 677743

Work: clare.bull@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Bounds Green
photo of Councillor Joanna Christophides

Councillor Joanna Christophides

Work mobile: 07854 544697

Work: joanna.christophides@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Bounds Green
photo of Councillor Ali Demirci

Councillor Ali Demirci

Cabinet Member for Planning

Work: 020 8489 2964 (office)

Work mobile: 075408 54293

Work: ali.demirci@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Bounds Green
photo of Councillor Joseph Ejiofor

Councillor Joseph Ejiofor

Work mobile: 07940 005507

Work: joseph.ejiofor@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Bruce Grove
photo of Councillor Stuart McNamara

Councillor Stuart McNamara

Cabinet Member for Environment

Work: 020 8489 2687 (office)

Work mobile: 07854 544696

Work: stuart.mcnamara@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Bruce Grove
photo of Councillor Felicia Opoku

Councillor Felicia Opoku

Work mobile: 07812 677717

Work: felicia.opoku@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Bruce Grove
photo of Councillor Jason Arthur

Councillor Jason Arthur

Cabinet Member for Resources and Culture

Work: 020 8489 2964 (office)

Work mobile: 07812 677736

Work: jason.arthur@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Crouch End
photo of Councillor Natan Doron

Councillor Natan Doron

Work mobile: 07815 700588

Work: natan.doron@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Crouch End
photo of Councillor Sarah Elliott

Councillor Sarah Elliott

Leader of the Opposition

Work mobile: 07812 677730

Work: sarah.elliott@haringey.gov.uk

Liberal Democrats Crouch End
photo of Councillor Patrick Berryman

Councillor Patrick Berryman

Work mobile: 07812 677741

Work: patrick.berryman@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Fortis Green
photo of Councillor Martin Newton

Councillor Martin Newton

Home: 020 8489 4005

Work: martin.newton@haringey.gov.uk

Liberal Democrats Fortis Green
photo of Councillor Viv Ross

Councillor Viv Ross

Work: 0208 444 9516

Work: viv.ross@haringey.gov.uk

Liberal Democrats Fortis Green
photo of Councillor Gina Adamou

Councillor Gina Adamou

Work: gina.adamou@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Harringay
photo of Councillor Emine Ibrahim

Councillor Emine Ibrahim

Work mobile: 07812 677724

Work: emine.ibrahim@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Harringay
photo of Councillor James Ryan

Councillor James Ryan

Work mobile: 07812 677710

Work: james.ryan@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Harringay
photo of Councillor Clive Carter

Councillor Clive Carter

Work mobile: 07812 677737

Work: clive.carter@haringey.gov.uk

Liberal Democrats Highgate
photo of Councillor Bob Hare

Councillor Bob Hare

Home: 020 8348 2710

Work mobile: 07870 157703

Work: bob.hare@haringey.gov.uk

Liberal Democrats Highgate
photo of Councillor Liz Morris

Councillor Liz Morris

Work mobile: 07818 094573

Work: liz.morris@haringey.gov.uk

Liberal Democrats Highgate
photo of Councillor Adam Jogee

Councillor Adam Jogee

Work mobile: 07812 677723

Work: adam.jogee@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Hornsey
photo of Councillor Jennifer Mann

Councillor Jennifer Mann

Work mobile: 07812 677727

Work: jennifer.mann@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Hornsey
photo of Councillor Elin Weston

Councillor Elin Weston

Work mobile: 07812 677 711

Work: elin.weston@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Hornsey
photo of Councillor Mark Blake

Councillor Mark Blake

Work mobile: 07812 677738

Work: mark.blake@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Muswell Hill
photo of Councillor Pippa Connor

Councillor Pippa Connor

Chair of Adults and Health Scrutiny Panel

Work mobile: 07812 677734

Work: pippa.connor@haringey.gov.uk

Liberal Democrats Muswell Hill
photo of Councillor Gail Engert

Councillor Gail Engert

Home: 020 8489 4005

Work: gail.engert@haringey.gov.uk

Liberal Democrats Muswell Hill
photo of Councillor Peray Ahmet

Councillor Peray Ahmet

Work mobile: 07812 677735

Work: peray.ahmet@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Noel Park
photo of Councillor Denise Marshall

Councillor Denise Marshall

Work mobile: 07812 677721

Work: denise.marshall@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Noel Park
photo of Councillor Alan Strickland

Councillor Alan Strickland

Cabinet Member for Housing and Regeneration

Work: 020 8489 2964 (office)

Work mobile: 07854 481050

Work: alan.strickland@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Noel Park
photo of Councillor Kaushika Amin

Councillor Kaushika Amin

Mayor of Haringey

Work mobile: 07977 562105

Work: kaushika.amin@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Northumberland Park
photo of Councillor John Bevan

Councillor John Bevan

Work mobile: 07967 336448

Work: john.bevan@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Northumberland Park
photo of Councillor Sheila Peacock

Councillor Sheila Peacock

Work mobile: 07967 336234

Work: sheila.peacock@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Northumberland Park
photo of Councillor Dhiren Basu

Councillor Dhiren Basu

Work mobile: 07971 804722

Work: dhiren.basu@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Seven Sisters
photo of Councillor Joe Goldberg

Councillor Joe Goldberg

Cabinet Member for Economic Development, Social Inclusion and Sustainability

Work: 020 8489 2687 (office)

Work mobile: 07794 218566

Work: joe.goldberg@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Seven Sisters
photo of Councillor Claire Kober

Councillor Claire Kober

Leader of the Council

Work: 020 8489 2241

Work: claire.kober@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Seven Sisters
photo of Councillor Barbara Blake

Councillor Barbara Blake

Chair of Environment and Community Safety Scrutiny Panel

Work mobile: 078126 77740

Work: barbara.blake@haringey.gov.uk

Labour St Ann's
photo of Councillor Peter Morton

Councillor Peter Morton

Cabinet Member for Health and Wellbeing

Work: 020 8489 2964 (office)

Work mobile: 07812 677713

Work: peter.morton@haringey.gov.uk

Labour St Ann's
photo of Councillor Ali Gul Ozbek

Councillor Ali Gul Ozbek

Work mobile: 07812 677716

Work: aligul.ozbek@haringey.gov.uk

Labour St Ann's
photo of Councillor Tim Gallagher

Councillor Tim Gallagher

Work mobile: 07812 677728

Work: tim.gallagher@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Stroud Green
photo of Councillor Kirsten Hearn

Councillor Kirsten Hearn

Chair of Children and Young People Scrutiny Panel

Work mobile: 07583 119123

Work: kirsten.hearn@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Stroud Green
photo of Councillor Raj Sahota

Councillor Raj Sahota

Work mobile: 07812 677709

Work: raj.sahota@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Stroud Green
photo of Councillor Isidoros Diakides

Councillor Isidoros Diakides

Home: 020 8340 8477

Work: isidoros.diakides@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Tottenham Green
photo of Councillor Makbule Gunes

Councillor Makbule Gunes

Work mobile: 07812 677722

Work: makbule.gunes@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Tottenham Green
photo of Councillor Bernice Vanier

Councillor Bernice Vanier

Deputy Leader and Cabinet Member for Communities

Work: 020 8489 2241 (office)

Work mobile: 07817 954961

Work: bernice.vanier@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Tottenham Green
photo of Councillor Vincent Carroll

Councillor Vincent Carroll

Work mobile: 07812 677739

Work: vincent.carroll@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Tottenham Hale
photo of Councillor Lorna Reith

Councillor Lorna Reith

Home: 020 8376 2310

Work: lorna.reith@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Tottenham Hale
photo of Councillor Reg Rice

Councillor Reg Rice

Work mobile: 07854 002078

Work: reg.rice@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Tottenham Hale
photo of Councillor Eugene Akwasi-Ayisi

Councillor Eugene Akwasi-Ayisi

Work mobile: 07812 677732

Work: eugene.akwasi-Ayisi@haringey.gov.uk

Labour West Green
photo of Councillor Eddie Griffith

Councillor Eddie Griffith

Work mobile: 07870 157701

Work: eddie.griffith@haringey.gov.uk

Labour West Green
photo of Councillor Toni Mallett

Councillor Toni Mallett

Work mobile: 07870 157883

Work: toni.mallett@haringey.gov.uk

Labour West Green
photo of Councillor Charles Adje

Councillor Charles Adje

Chair of Housing and Regeneration Scrutiny Panel

Home: 020 8800 7658

Work: charles.adje@haringey.gov.uk

Labour White Hart Lane
photo of Councillor Gideon Bull

Councillor Gideon Bull

Chair Overview & Scrutiny Committee

Work mobile: 077995 86111

Work: whl@gideonbull.co.uk

Labour White Hart Lane
photo of Councillor Anne Stennett

Councillor Anne Stennett

Work: public no - 020 8815 9208

Work mobile: 07854 002675

Work: anne.stennett@haringey.gov.uk

Labour White Hart Lane
photo of Councillor George Meehan

Councillor George Meehan

Work mobile: 07967 336120

Work: george.meehan@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Woodside
photo of Councillor Ann Waters

Councillor Ann Waters

Cabinet Member for Children and Families

Work: 020 8489 2687(office)

Work mobile: 07854 002470

Work: ann.waters@haringey.gov.uk

Labour Woodside

----------------------------------------------------------------

Please, please don't make personal comments about their views, conduct, strengths, failing etc - this is a discussion about how and why we can get them to be active participants on HoL, not a chance to lambaste/praise them.

Tags for Forum Posts: Catherine West, David Lammy, Lynne Featherstone, MP, democracy, engagement, involvement, local politics

Views: 5092

Reply to This

Replies to This Discussion

We cannot know, no, but we can draw reasonable conclusions, Chris. What we can reasonably conclude is that there has been no discernible effect. IF the effect is there, it remains to be discerned. Happy discerning!

For the libdems you can just compare the votes of the two incumbents to the new candidate and "discern" from there. It is just my opinion but I cannot think of a single post that either of them have made on HoL that would put me off voting for them. I can't say the same for any of the other candidates in Harringay in 2014...

I agree with the low awareness/national brand of politics aligned vote line of thinking, a local councillor is effectively invisible to most people so what have you got to go on?

A local councillor needs about 1500 votes to get elected, so needs to be visible to about 7500 people, as only 3000 will be voting (assumes 38% turnout and 50/50 lab/tory split, for simplicity's sake).  You'd need to create visibility with 80 people a day and get the vote of 16 of them in the last three months before an election (window picked because of I'm assuming people forget candidates names/recency effect) - epic challenge.

It would be an interesting experiment if local candidates were only listed by name, and excluded party affiliation.  Outcome? Closer to a random distribution, probably skewed towards the candidates listed at the top of the ballot.

Err, silly.

How many people voted for their favourite national party in the Harringay Ward elections?  If everyone did, there'd be no need to campaign at all locally.

Don't use your fire on those already on your side - parties use the electoral roll and ask people how they voted to build up lists of the 'doubters' using software - Labour and the Lib Dems use the same package and everyone buys data from Expirian, the credit rating agency who the Tories decided could do the public a service they could pay for and privatised this function.  

Parties then figure out who is likely to be swayed and try to engage them directly. One wining margin in Harringey was 250 votes - convince more than half of those to vote for you and you've won. Elections are once every four years.  That's one person or so every month...

The local Labour Party consistently campaigned on national issues (the bedroom tax!) and pushed other issues like the corruption in their selection processes under the carpet (just some racists).

In Haringey, it works like this:

  • Politicians and Public Services do not listen to the residents on these forums or any other Forums
  • The Politicians and Public Services then go off and do their own thing
  • Which irritates the residents because it is not what they want
  • The Politicians and Public Services know they are not providing what people want, so refrain from commenting on sites like this for fear of getting a mauling
  • Everyone knows if they say mention anything, not much will happen, so why bother posting anything?

What you might call the dialogue of the deaf and a democratic disconnect.

I'm convinced the Labour councillors have been advised by the party not to comment in this forum.

That's a conspiracy theory too far for me, Ben.

What a weird picture of the world you maintain - one in which 'the party' gives out 'advice' like this - not even in Tunbridge Wells do parties do this, I'll bet.

Wow, a world without party whips where politicians and councillors are free to tow whatever line they wish, with no party cohesion whatsoever. Though perhaps not in Tunbridge Wells or Haringey or Harringay, I'll bet .

I think the Greens abandoned the whip, didn't they?

Although maybe they kept it just for the right Royal Tunbridge Wells 

Perhaps they did, but aren't we discussing the Labour Party?

RSS

Advertising

© 2024   Created by Hugh.   Powered by

Badges  |  Report an Issue  |  Terms of Service